WFMU: Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from July 15, 2024

Listener comments!
	5:51pm ultradamno: Mark! Techtonigentsia!
	🤖 5:59pm chresti: Hi Mark and techtonicians!
	🤖 5:59pm Handy Haversack: Mark! Techyons! Looking forward to this one!
	6:00pm ultradamno: Bagel fluid looks like it's going to hatch aliens
	6:01pm Jason Koebler: Hey all! This is Jason, the guest this week ... I'll be hanging out in the chat if you have any questions!
	6:01pm gabriel: heyo mark and friends!
	🤖 6:01pm herb.nyc: Hey hey. Maybe mark should interview Tomaš Dvořák. (He alive?)
	6:02pm gabriel: hey jason!
	6:02pm mackeral: hey folks!
	🤖 6:02pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:01 Ah, you're with 404, from your last appearance here? Great site.
	🤖 6:02pm herb.nyc: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:01 Look. Jason is here. Ai version of Jason?
	6:03pm joe_rosevear: Hello all!
	6:04pm Jason Koebler: real version of jason! havent cloned myself yet
	🤖 6:05pm David (in London): Evening Mark and all Technoids.
	6:05pm ultradamno: And You Tube...it's pretty much my entire recs now
	6:08pm Peter from Saranac Lake NY: Hello Mark and fellow travelers. FB indeed has stopped trying. Any content regArding Project 2025 is moderated by a far right website called The Dispatch.
	6:09pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:04 Thanks for joining, Jason!
	6:09pm alex: great topic! can we talk about all the crap "sites" that come up when you do a simple web search? like, "how to cook catfish?" you suddenly get hits from cookcatfish.com, catfish4me.com, etc.....thx!
	6:10pm Mark Hurst: Hi also to ultra, chresti, Handy, gabriel, herb, mackeral, joe, DiL, Peter, alex!
	6:11pm Fredericks: ↳ alex @6:09 What search engine do you use?
	🤖 6:12pm Ken From Hyde Park: Greetings, Mark and Koebler elves!
	6:12pm Fredericks: Hello Jason and Mark and my fellow Techtonitites.
	6:13pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:12 Hi Ken, hi Fredericks!
	6:14pm Sam: This is funny to me when I think back that the reason I quit Facebook was because it was so corny and saccharine and fake wholesome and happy.
	6:16pm alex: hi fredericks! i ditched google long ago, now use duckduckgo which still blows. just sick of fake articles (farticles) with that shite 4th grade font written by "tommy" or "janey" that pose as catfish professionals! :)
	6:17pm Fredericks: ↳ Sam @6:14 Enshittification is what it is called, I believe. Have to verify with Cory Doctorow.
	6:17pm mr 6: FB fact checkers results are based on moderator opinions Accounts that are hacked are lost forever 99%of use of the N….r word are found to not be in violation of community standards yet if you type white trash you will be in FB jail
	6:17pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Fredericks @6:17 Cory Doctorow discussed the concept on Techtonic, just after he coined the term, back in March 2023: www.wfmu.org...
	🤖 6:18pm Folsom: I just did a catfish cooking search, I get allrecipes, delish, etc. , no really goofy websites.
	6:19pm ultradamno: It would seem hiring some Burmese speakers would have been a bare minimum before launching there
	6:20pm Mark Hurst: ↳ ultradamno @6:19 If I remember right, civil groups & activists in Myanmar were begging Facebook to do just that... and got very little attention
	6:21pm gabriel: the internet used to be fun. now it sucks. go for a walk, hang w your friends and neighbors.
	6:21pm gabriel: play mah jongg
	6:22pm Fredericks: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:17 Would you say the term fits what happened to Facebook?
	🤖 6:23pm Folsom: It's funny that people are concerned about censoring conservative talk, it's not like they are censoring Laffer curve or Austrian economics content. It's pretty much disinformation that get moderated.
	6:23pm Stevel: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:20 I came in on the end of the Burma/Myanmar topic. Could someone provide a link?
	6:25pm ultradamno: Or they could take ads from any weird crypto scam company no one has ever heard of...like Twitter!
	🤖 6:25pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Stevel @6:23 www.amnesty.org... www.bbc.co.uk...
	6:27pm alex: folsom, you just fixed the internet! ok i can't even find a decent example but i swear i see them all the time. maybe i need to lay off that meth i got off FB
	6:28pm A➡B: Evenin Mark, Jason, Technocrits & Technocrats! I'm convinced and worried that the premature integration of AI on the internet could be part of a "covert operation" (read: conspiracy) to make the internet less user-friendly, out of hyperbolically addressed concern over perpetrated hacker attacks, while at the same time, ironically, putting active sites at risk of premature deprecation as a result of bombardment of hacking attacks by AI-bots. (Yes, believe me, it's really happening!)
	6:29pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Fredericks @6:22 of course
	6:30pm Stevel: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:25 Thank you, sir! On quick review, I do recall the story. The government definitely took full advantage of the opportunity, as they are want to do. See current day. www.irrawaddy.com...
	🤖 6:30pm Folsom: ↳ alex @6:27 I'll just stay with huffing jenkem.
	🤖 6:30pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:29 I'd posit that it started pretty shitty ... but yes, they find new lows.
	6:31pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:30 Exactly right.
	6:31pm Jason Koebler: ↳ gabriel @6:21 you say this but this is basically my coping mechanism ... surfing, logging off ... ignoring my email for days on end. helps a lot
	6:33pm gabriel: do not huff jenkem
	🤖 6:33pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:31 Will you be on the cruise, Mark? I have a (vaguely) business(like) proposal for you! Be fun to tell you in person.
	🤖 6:33pm Folsom: I'm going to worry when AI starts cloning Wonderful Christmastime.
	6:33pm Fredericks: Those vocals sounded like Darlene Love to my ears.
	6:34pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:33 Unfortunately will miss it (and will miss next week's show - will mention after interview)
	6:35pm gabriel: can i take mark's place on this cruise?
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Folsom @6:33 Do we have any proof it wasn't originally generated by AI? Perhaps THAT is the super AI we have all been warned about -- going back in time to insert the worst song possible into cultural prominence and so doom America to destroying the world! Sneaky bastard!
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:34 Ah, sorry to hear! I will send you an e-mail.
	6:35pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:35 thanks
	🤖 6:36pm Webhamster Henry: I genned one that sounds like Stevie Wonder, harmonica and all! But my lyrics
	6:36pm ultradamno: Examples of the two main AI types pushed on You Tube www.youtube.com... www.youtube.com...
	6:37pm gabriel: im pretty sure the worst song was Friday by Rebecca Black and we've been doomed every since.
	6:38pm Fredericks: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:36 Let's hear hear it, Webhamster.
	6:39pm dale: i remember being in an east village bar with a jukebox and someone from ascap came in to shake down the owner for royalties from the music played on it. owner just went over and unplugged it and told hime to get lost.
	6:40pm Meatbag: I was hopeful that the copyright holders would fight back against AI in a more meaningful way than artists could, but I think that once the rightsholders and AI companies consolidate/merge (whats to stop them?) its game over. Any thoughts on this?
	6:43pm Fredericks: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 Monopolies are bad.
	6:43pm Stevel: The Mass Scraping of Human Output: Techno-darkmetal
	6:44pm Jim the Poet: To thwart AI I am writing all my poems in crayon now
	🤖 6:44pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 I'd think this is exactly what the label are aiming for the -- the legal clearance to use AI to generate copyrighted material out of a copyrighted corpus to sell to other media content creators so that, for example, all music used in TV will benefit only the labels, cutting artists even further out of the picture. I read some articles about this. Not sure I can lay my hand on a link, but I think the Techtonic ep. about a music union might have some? Or, er, what Jason is talking about right now.
	6:44pm ultradamno: ↳ Stevel @6:43 Could be a G.I.S.M title
	6:45pm Meatbag: ↳ Fredericks @6:43 No kidding. Not holding my breath for meaningful Antitrust to prevent this
	6:46pm Hunterian: Great episode, I'll be touting the archive widely.
	🤖 6:46pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Jim the Poet @6:44 They're training LLMs on millions of pounds of wax.
	6:46pm Jim the Poet: Hey
	🤖 6:47pm herb.nyc: Thx for the interview- so much said, so much import
	6:47pm Meatbag: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:44 yeah, I'm hearing this is already happening within labels from people in the industry.
	6:48pm gabriel: thanks jason! i suggest everyone boycott the internet.
	6:48pm chris in the redwoods: very happy 404 subscriber here! and, hello, everyone! very much enjoyed catching the last part of the interview and will listen from the beginning in the archives.
	6:49pm A➡B: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 How about thoughts on Scarlett Johanssen's lawsuit against one of the AI vocal simulator sites?
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: I think we talked about the writers and actor strikes last year, they are trying to accept that studios will be using generated talent, but if that talent is honestly part of the show, their virtual selves will trigger royalties. Music may be little too late for music, but it's a model at least.
	6:50pm Carla in NC: I am in the throes of the sandwich generation. It's tough!
	🤖 6:50pm Handy Haversack: I guess I'm in that generation, but I have neither parents nor kids.
	🤖 6:50pm Folsom: I figured a sandwich generation were people that liked Warren Zevon.
	6:50pm ultradamno: What was crazy about that was they tried to hire her first and then went AI after they couldn't get her. They'll just go AI right off next time rather than risk a paper trail.
	6:50pm Fredericks: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:44 Rick Beato recently explained why pop music keeps getting worse. Seems like AI will just speed up the process of generating boring, predictable music.
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: I'm an open faced sandwich.
	6:51pm Fredericks: ↳ Jim the Poet @6:44 Good thinking, Jim.
	🤖 6:51pm herb.nyc: Yay, Brian of Currants, my favorite fruit (we all know that orange is not the only fruit. Let’s see if someone will sue me)
	6:51pm Meatbag: ↳ A➡B @6:49 the lawsuits are generally encouraging. I just see a merger of upstarts and copyright holders as inevitable in the current climate. Individual artists dont stand a chance, but major rights holders do (as the interview stated)
	6:52pm morphe': Someone some 2-3 months ago complained about the news on BD's show [Currents Sat ET 6-9am ]... was curiously ???
	🤖 6:52pm MarciB: Thank you Mark, another excellent interview!
	6:52pm gabriel: 3 cheers for mediocrity!
	6:52pm Meatbag: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:50 hopefully its not like spotify lol
	6:54pm dale: the political violence was caused by the most diseased person - the one who the violence was perpetrated against.
	6:54pm gabriel: save your mental health and use the internet only for buying hard to find instruments and listening to wfmu.
	6:54pm ultradamno: It was hard not to suspect AI when that 'picture of the bullet whizzing by in mid-air' shot starting showing up everywhere
	6:54pm Fredericks: What if it wasn't political violence? Maybe it was just a run-of-the-mill mass shooting.
	6:54pm morphe': ↳ Song: "Mark's comments" Political Violence Reflections from the 1920s and 1930s https://snyder.substack.com/p/political-violence
	🤖 6:55pm MarciB: I read that Robert Putnam (author of "Bowling Alone") had predicted the situation we find ourselves in with Big Tech etc
	🤖 6:55pm herb.nyc: Taking a cue from Brian of Currents, mark brings up social disease. Cue the song of same name, by Elton John.
	🤖 6:55pm tim: Hey everyone. What happened at the rally?
	🤖 6:55pm Webhamster Henry: Sure! Automobiles isolate people, makes them feel invincible, and are existentially anti social. Also, their externalities are putting extra energy into the environment.
	6:55pm Carla in NC: I cherish the days before the "cesspool internet"
	6:55pm Fredericks: ↳ Meatbag @6:45 Where's Teddy Roosevelt when you need him?
	6:55pm Sam: Serious question: Were we better off in the nineties when politics was super bland, the two parties were almost the same, and everyone was apathetic? Back then that’s what everyone complained about, and the big challenge was to get young people to care about politics at all.
	6:56pm dale: ↳ Fredericks @6:55 bully!
	6:56pm ultradamno: Yeah, the rough rider finished his speech
	6:56pm yippie: If you search YouTube for videos that don’t exist (like rare songs) instead of saying “0 results” sometimes YouTube would try to show me videos of people being killed or other disturbing content。
	🤖 6:56pm chresti: Garbage Book
	🤖 6:57pm MarciB: Love my library!
	6:57pm gabriel: yeh i stand by my comments! public libraries rule and have mah jongg groups!
	6:57pm RyanInSC: amazing message
	🤖 6:57pm chresti: Thanks Mark!
	6:57pm A➡B: Thanks, Mark! Keep fighting the good fight!
	6:57pm ?: “SHOOTER”©dday I'm a time bomb ticking No hope left inside Fuse lit, safety clicking No place that I can run to No place that I can hide It started many years ago I was such a tiny boy Didn't play well with others My toys were, well, MY toys She tried her best to shield me Mothers are so aware Dad said to toughen up boy That was just his way to care Soon the doctors analyzed me My mind & body filled with drugs When all I really needed Was some comfort & a hug Never really fit in at my school A zombie out of sorts A dreamer in my own world Afraid of girls, no good at sports The priest called me a devil As he unbuckled his pants He said you are an evil child As he did his filthy dance So I sat inside a dark room Madness screaming from the screen Imagining the clamor & the chaos When I show them what I mean So yeah I'm a time bomb ticking Staring at my screen Taking in the madness Feeling lonely, feeling mean My mind is wildly racing My brain it is on fire I only have one goal now I have only one desire I hope you are all happy While you talked in whispered tones About that lonely, mixed up kid Who never felt at home Yeah, I'm a time bomb ticking My best friend my computer It's all become so sickening No heart , no soul, I'm just The Shooter
	6:57pm RyanInSC: thank you
	🤖 6:57pm Handy Haversack: I have SOME print books that I suspect of surveilling me ... Enjoy the break, Mark! Many thanks to you and Jason for a great talk.
	🤖 6:57pm Elena: Thank you for a great episode!
	6:57pm gabriel: thanks mark and jason!
	6:58pm chris in the redwoods: thanks, Mark and Jason! toodles, all.
	6:58pm dale: ken and andy need to write an a.i. song. 'when the sweating goes down' maybe.
	🤖 6:58pm Ken From Hyde Park: Thanks, Mark & Jason.
	6:59pm Mark Hurst: Thanks, everyone!
	6:59pm alex: i actually prefer this version of dancing queen
	6:59pm Sam: This sounds very fake to me. Like those artificially flavored nutri grain bars that pretend to taste like blueberry.
	6:59pm Mennlinn Rebarts: more psychic damage in 5 seconds of this then the entire archive of music of mind control
	6:59pm Fredericks: ↳ dale @6:56 Bully!
	7:00pm ultradamno: I had a dream in which I ran out of peanut oil and a pretty girl appeared in my kitchen telling me I should use a well-known brand of microwave popcorn...they're already advertising in our dreams!
	7:00pm A➡B: I've long imagined ELO covering "Don't Walk Away, Renée", then suddenly realizing they had a track on the Xanadu soundtrack called "Don't Walk Away", sounding nothing like the former.
	7:00pm Mennlinn Rebarts: ↳ Sam @6:59 make sure to check out the June 10 Techtonic if you haven't

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from July 15, 2024

View Mark Hurst's profile

Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. In our shift to a digital future, we need alternatives to Big Tech. Homepage: techtonic.fm

Also available as an MP3 podcast. More info at our Podcast Central page.

<-- Previous playlist | Back to Techtonic with Mark Hurst playlists | Next playlist -->

Upcoming events:

Mon. Dec 23rd, 6pm - 7pm: Don Fleming guest hosts Techtonic
Mon. Dec 30th, 6pm - 7pm: Andrew Smith, author, "Devil in the Stack" (More info...)
Writer Andrew Smith decided to learn computer programming in his 50s. What happened next is captured in his book "Devil in the Stack: A Code Odyssey," and wide-ranging tour through computer history, neuroscience, and the friendliest programming language.

July 15, 2024: Generative AI and the "cesspool internet" – with Jason Koebler

Listen to this show: MP3 - 128K | Pop-up listen Pop-up player!

Today: Jason Koebler on how the spread of generative AI, and the absence of effective content moderation, are creating a “disastrous, zombified, cesspool” of an internet. From the scam-ridden Facebook to AI-generated music sludge, our online future is looking more and more like a dying, decaying mall.

• Has Facebook stopped trying? (June 24, 2024) by Jason in 404 Media

• Listen to the AI-Generated Ripoff Songs That Got Udio and Suno Sued (June 24, 2024) by Jason in 404 Media

• The 404 Media podcast

• Jason's first appearance on Techtonic: Jan 8, 2024

Sign up to get Mark’s weekly email newsletter.

PAST EPISODES: techtonic.fm lists recent Techtonic shows.

PODCAST: If you use an open podcast player reader, here’s an RSS feed. If you have to use a Big Tech podcast app, here’s Techtonic on iTunes.

Artist	Track	Approx. start time
Generative AI and the "cesspool internet" – with Jason Koebler
Tomaš Dvořák	Game Boy Tune "Game Boy Tune" by "Tomaš Dvořák"
	Mark's intro "Mark's intro"
	Interview with Jason Koebler "Interview with Jason Koebler"	0:03:50 (MP3 \| Pop-up)
	Mark's comments "Mark's comments"	0:42:22 (MP3 \| Pop-up)
	AI ripoff songs "AI ripoff songs"	0:54:38 (MP3 \| Pop-up)

RSS feeds for Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlists feed | MP3 archives feed

| E-mail Mark Hurst | Other WFMU Playlists | All artists played by Techtonic with Mark Hurst |

Listener comments!
	5:51pm ultradamno: Mark! Techtonigentsia!
	🤖 5:59pm chresti: Hi Mark and techtonicians!
	🤖 5:59pm Handy Haversack: Mark! Techyons! Looking forward to this one!
	6:00pm ultradamno: Bagel fluid looks like it's going to hatch aliens
	6:01pm Jason Koebler: Hey all! This is Jason, the guest this week ... I'll be hanging out in the chat if you have any questions!
	6:01pm gabriel: heyo mark and friends!
	🤖 6:01pm herb.nyc: Hey hey. Maybe mark should interview Tomaš Dvořák. (He alive?)
	6:02pm gabriel: hey jason!
	6:02pm mackeral: hey folks!
	🤖 6:02pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:01 Ah, you're with 404, from your last appearance here? Great site.
	🤖 6:02pm herb.nyc: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:01 Look. Jason is here. Ai version of Jason?
	6:03pm joe_rosevear: Hello all!
	6:04pm Jason Koebler: real version of jason! havent cloned myself yet
	🤖 6:05pm David (in London): Evening Mark and all Technoids.
	6:05pm ultradamno: And You Tube...it's pretty much my entire recs now
	6:08pm Peter from Saranac Lake NY: Hello Mark and fellow travelers. FB indeed has stopped trying. Any content regArding Project 2025 is moderated by a far right website called The Dispatch.
	6:09pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Jason Koebler @6:04 Thanks for joining, Jason!
	6:09pm alex: great topic! can we talk about all the crap "sites" that come up when you do a simple web search? like, "how to cook catfish?" you suddenly get hits from cookcatfish.com, catfish4me.com, etc.....thx!
	6:10pm Mark Hurst: Hi also to ultra, chresti, Handy, gabriel, herb, mackeral, joe, DiL, Peter, alex!
	6:11pm Fredericks: ↳ alex @6:09 What search engine do you use?
	🤖 6:12pm Ken From Hyde Park: Greetings, Mark and Koebler elves!
	6:12pm Fredericks: Hello Jason and Mark and my fellow Techtonitites.
	6:13pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:12 Hi Ken, hi Fredericks!
	6:14pm Sam: This is funny to me when I think back that the reason I quit Facebook was because it was so corny and saccharine and fake wholesome and happy.
	6:16pm alex: hi fredericks! i ditched google long ago, now use duckduckgo which still blows. just sick of fake articles (farticles) with that shite 4th grade font written by "tommy" or "janey" that pose as catfish professionals! :)
	6:17pm Fredericks: ↳ Sam @6:14 Enshittification is what it is called, I believe. Have to verify with Cory Doctorow.
	6:17pm mr 6: FB fact checkers results are based on moderator opinions Accounts that are hacked are lost forever 99%of use of the N….r word are found to not be in violation of community standards yet if you type white trash you will be in FB jail
	6:17pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Fredericks @6:17 Cory Doctorow discussed the concept on Techtonic, just after he coined the term, back in March 2023: www.wfmu.org...
	🤖 6:18pm Folsom: I just did a catfish cooking search, I get allrecipes, delish, etc. , no really goofy websites.
	6:19pm ultradamno: It would seem hiring some Burmese speakers would have been a bare minimum before launching there
	6:20pm Mark Hurst: ↳ ultradamno @6:19 If I remember right, civil groups & activists in Myanmar were begging Facebook to do just that... and got very little attention
	6:21pm gabriel: the internet used to be fun. now it sucks. go for a walk, hang w your friends and neighbors.
	6:21pm gabriel: play mah jongg
	6:22pm Fredericks: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:17 Would you say the term fits what happened to Facebook?
	🤖 6:23pm Folsom: It's funny that people are concerned about censoring conservative talk, it's not like they are censoring Laffer curve or Austrian economics content. It's pretty much disinformation that get moderated.
	6:23pm Stevel: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:20 I came in on the end of the Burma/Myanmar topic. Could someone provide a link?
	6:25pm ultradamno: Or they could take ads from any weird crypto scam company no one has ever heard of...like Twitter!
	🤖 6:25pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Stevel @6:23 www.amnesty.org... www.bbc.co.uk...
	6:27pm alex: folsom, you just fixed the internet! ok i can't even find a decent example but i swear i see them all the time. maybe i need to lay off that meth i got off FB
	6:28pm A➡B: Evenin Mark, Jason, Technocrits & Technocrats! I'm convinced and worried that the premature integration of AI on the internet could be part of a "covert operation" (read: conspiracy) to make the internet less user-friendly, out of hyperbolically addressed concern over perpetrated hacker attacks, while at the same time, ironically, putting active sites at risk of premature deprecation as a result of bombardment of hacking attacks by AI-bots. (Yes, believe me, it's really happening!)
	6:29pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Fredericks @6:22 of course
	6:30pm Stevel: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:25 Thank you, sir! On quick review, I do recall the story. The government definitely took full advantage of the opportunity, as they are want to do. See current day. www.irrawaddy.com...
	🤖 6:30pm Folsom: ↳ alex @6:27 I'll just stay with huffing jenkem.
	🤖 6:30pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:29 I'd posit that it started pretty shitty ... but yes, they find new lows.
	6:31pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:30 Exactly right.
	6:31pm Jason Koebler: ↳ gabriel @6:21 you say this but this is basically my coping mechanism ... surfing, logging off ... ignoring my email for days on end. helps a lot
	6:33pm gabriel: do not huff jenkem
	🤖 6:33pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:31 Will you be on the cruise, Mark? I have a (vaguely) business(like) proposal for you! Be fun to tell you in person.
	🤖 6:33pm Folsom: I'm going to worry when AI starts cloning Wonderful Christmastime.
	6:33pm Fredericks: Those vocals sounded like Darlene Love to my ears.
	6:34pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:33 Unfortunately will miss it (and will miss next week's show - will mention after interview)
	6:35pm gabriel: can i take mark's place on this cruise?
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Folsom @6:33 Do we have any proof it wasn't originally generated by AI? Perhaps THAT is the super AI we have all been warned about -- going back in time to insert the worst song possible into cultural prominence and so doom America to destroying the world! Sneaky bastard!
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Mark Hurst @6:34 Ah, sorry to hear! I will send you an e-mail.
	6:35pm Mark Hurst: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:35 thanks
	🤖 6:36pm Webhamster Henry: I genned one that sounds like Stevie Wonder, harmonica and all! But my lyrics
	6:36pm ultradamno: Examples of the two main AI types pushed on You Tube www.youtube.com... www.youtube.com...
	6:37pm gabriel: im pretty sure the worst song was Friday by Rebecca Black and we've been doomed every since.
	6:38pm Fredericks: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:36 Let's hear hear it, Webhamster.
	6:39pm dale: i remember being in an east village bar with a jukebox and someone from ascap came in to shake down the owner for royalties from the music played on it. owner just went over and unplugged it and told hime to get lost.
	6:40pm Meatbag: I was hopeful that the copyright holders would fight back against AI in a more meaningful way than artists could, but I think that once the rightsholders and AI companies consolidate/merge (whats to stop them?) its game over. Any thoughts on this?
	6:43pm Fredericks: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 Monopolies are bad.
	6:43pm Stevel: The Mass Scraping of Human Output: Techno-darkmetal
	6:44pm Jim the Poet: To thwart AI I am writing all my poems in crayon now
	🤖 6:44pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 I'd think this is exactly what the label are aiming for the -- the legal clearance to use AI to generate copyrighted material out of a copyrighted corpus to sell to other media content creators so that, for example, all music used in TV will benefit only the labels, cutting artists even further out of the picture. I read some articles about this. Not sure I can lay my hand on a link, but I think the Techtonic ep. about a music union might have some? Or, er, what Jason is talking about right now.
	6:44pm ultradamno: ↳ Stevel @6:43 Could be a G.I.S.M title
	6:45pm Meatbag: ↳ Fredericks @6:43 No kidding. Not holding my breath for meaningful Antitrust to prevent this
	6:46pm Hunterian: Great episode, I'll be touting the archive widely.
	🤖 6:46pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Jim the Poet @6:44 They're training LLMs on millions of pounds of wax.
	6:46pm Jim the Poet: Hey
	🤖 6:47pm herb.nyc: Thx for the interview- so much said, so much import
	6:47pm Meatbag: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:44 yeah, I'm hearing this is already happening within labels from people in the industry.
	6:48pm gabriel: thanks jason! i suggest everyone boycott the internet.
	6:48pm chris in the redwoods: very happy 404 subscriber here! and, hello, everyone! very much enjoyed catching the last part of the interview and will listen from the beginning in the archives.
	6:49pm A➡B: ↳ Meatbag @6:40 How about thoughts on Scarlett Johanssen's lawsuit against one of the AI vocal simulator sites?
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: I think we talked about the writers and actor strikes last year, they are trying to accept that studios will be using generated talent, but if that talent is honestly part of the show, their virtual selves will trigger royalties. Music may be little too late for music, but it's a model at least.
	6:50pm Carla in NC: I am in the throes of the sandwich generation. It's tough!
	🤖 6:50pm Handy Haversack: I guess I'm in that generation, but I have neither parents nor kids.
	🤖 6:50pm Folsom: I figured a sandwich generation were people that liked Warren Zevon.
	6:50pm ultradamno: What was crazy about that was they tried to hire her first and then went AI after they couldn't get her. They'll just go AI right off next time rather than risk a paper trail.
	6:50pm Fredericks: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:44 Rick Beato recently explained why pop music keeps getting worse. Seems like AI will just speed up the process of generating boring, predictable music.
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: I'm an open faced sandwich.
	6:51pm Fredericks: ↳ Jim the Poet @6:44 Good thinking, Jim.
	🤖 6:51pm herb.nyc: Yay, Brian of Currants, my favorite fruit (we all know that orange is not the only fruit. Let’s see if someone will sue me)
	6:51pm Meatbag: ↳ A➡B @6:49 the lawsuits are generally encouraging. I just see a merger of upstarts and copyright holders as inevitable in the current climate. Individual artists dont stand a chance, but major rights holders do (as the interview stated)
	6:52pm morphe': Someone some 2-3 months ago complained about the news on BD's show [Currents Sat ET 6-9am ]... was curiously ???
	🤖 6:52pm MarciB: Thank you Mark, another excellent interview!
	6:52pm gabriel: 3 cheers for mediocrity!
	6:52pm Meatbag: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:50 hopefully its not like spotify lol
	6:54pm dale: the political violence was caused by the most diseased person - the one who the violence was perpetrated against.
	6:54pm gabriel: save your mental health and use the internet only for buying hard to find instruments and listening to wfmu.
	6:54pm ultradamno: It was hard not to suspect AI when that 'picture of the bullet whizzing by in mid-air' shot starting showing up everywhere
	6:54pm Fredericks: What if it wasn't political violence? Maybe it was just a run-of-the-mill mass shooting.
	6:54pm morphe': ↳ Song: "Mark's comments" Political Violence Reflections from the 1920s and 1930s https://snyder.substack.com/p/political-violence
	🤖 6:55pm MarciB: I read that Robert Putnam (author of "Bowling Alone") had predicted the situation we find ourselves in with Big Tech etc
	🤖 6:55pm herb.nyc: Taking a cue from Brian of Currents, mark brings up social disease. Cue the song of same name, by Elton John.
	🤖 6:55pm tim: Hey everyone. What happened at the rally?
	🤖 6:55pm Webhamster Henry: Sure! Automobiles isolate people, makes them feel invincible, and are existentially anti social. Also, their externalities are putting extra energy into the environment.
	6:55pm Carla in NC: I cherish the days before the "cesspool internet"
	6:55pm Fredericks: ↳ Meatbag @6:45 Where's Teddy Roosevelt when you need him?
	6:55pm Sam: Serious question: Were we better off in the nineties when politics was super bland, the two parties were almost the same, and everyone was apathetic? Back then that’s what everyone complained about, and the big challenge was to get young people to care about politics at all.
	6:56pm dale: ↳ Fredericks @6:55 bully!
	6:56pm ultradamno: Yeah, the rough rider finished his speech
	6:56pm yippie: If you search YouTube for videos that don’t exist (like rare songs) instead of saying “0 results” sometimes YouTube would try to show me videos of people being killed or other disturbing content。
	🤖 6:56pm chresti: Garbage Book
	🤖 6:57pm MarciB: Love my library!
	6:57pm gabriel: yeh i stand by my comments! public libraries rule and have mah jongg groups!
	6:57pm RyanInSC: amazing message
	🤖 6:57pm chresti: Thanks Mark!
	6:57pm A➡B: Thanks, Mark! Keep fighting the good fight!
	6:57pm ?: “SHOOTER”©dday I'm a time bomb ticking No hope left inside Fuse lit, safety clicking No place that I can run to No place that I can hide It started many years ago I was such a tiny boy Didn't play well with others My toys were, well, MY toys She tried her best to shield me Mothers are so aware Dad said to toughen up boy That was just his way to care Soon the doctors analyzed me My mind & body filled with drugs When all I really needed Was some comfort & a hug Never really fit in at my school A zombie out of sorts A dreamer in my own world Afraid of girls, no good at sports The priest called me a devil As he unbuckled his pants He said you are an evil child As he did his filthy dance So I sat inside a dark room Madness screaming from the screen Imagining the clamor & the chaos When I show them what I mean So yeah I'm a time bomb ticking Staring at my screen Taking in the madness Feeling lonely, feeling mean My mind is wildly racing My brain it is on fire I only have one goal now I have only one desire I hope you are all happy While you talked in whispered tones About that lonely, mixed up kid Who never felt at home Yeah, I'm a time bomb ticking My best friend my computer It's all become so sickening No heart , no soul, I'm just The Shooter
	6:57pm RyanInSC: thank you
	🤖 6:57pm Handy Haversack: I have SOME print books that I suspect of surveilling me ... Enjoy the break, Mark! Many thanks to you and Jason for a great talk.
	🤖 6:57pm Elena: Thank you for a great episode!
	6:57pm gabriel: thanks mark and jason!
	6:58pm chris in the redwoods: thanks, Mark and Jason! toodles, all.
	6:58pm dale: ken and andy need to write an a.i. song. 'when the sweating goes down' maybe.
	🤖 6:58pm Ken From Hyde Park: Thanks, Mark & Jason.
	6:59pm Mark Hurst: Thanks, everyone!
	6:59pm alex: i actually prefer this version of dancing queen
	6:59pm Sam: This sounds very fake to me. Like those artificially flavored nutri grain bars that pretend to taste like blueberry.
	6:59pm Mennlinn Rebarts: more psychic damage in 5 seconds of this then the entire archive of music of mind control
	6:59pm Fredericks: ↳ dale @6:56 Bully!
	7:00pm ultradamno: I had a dream in which I ran out of peanut oil and a pretty girl appeared in my kitchen telling me I should use a well-known brand of microwave popcorn...they're already advertising in our dreams!
	7:00pm A➡B: I've long imagined ELO covering "Don't Walk Away, Renée", then suddenly realizing they had a track on the Xanadu soundtrack called "Don't Walk Away", sounding nothing like the former.
	7:00pm Mennlinn Rebarts: ↳ Sam @6:59 make sure to check out the June 10 Techtonic if you haven't

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from July 15, 2024

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