WFMU: Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from November 4, 2019

Listener comments!
	6:01pm Fredericks: Hello, Technoids.
	6:01pm ultradamno: Hello Mark! Techton'r Treaters!
	6:02pm Rand al'Thor: I'm actually in the chat for once. Good evening, all!
	6:02pm John from Florham park: Hello fellow technoids
	🤖 6:02pm chresti: Hi Mark and Techtoniclandia!
	6:02pm geezerette: Greetings, Mark and all!
	🤖 6:03pm Webhamster Henry: The tones of tech means it's time for another show!
	6:03pm Ike: Hi all!
	6:03pm queems: howdy mark, others
	6:03pm Carmichael: Heya Mark and Hour-Behinders.
	🤖 6:04pm Bas NL: Hi Mark! Techtonic-philes!
	6:04pm John from Florham park: @Queems howdy
	6:04pm Rand al'Thor: Yay, good news show!
	🤖 6:04pm Ken From Hyde Park: Yay, Mark! Put your Fitbit on and lead the Techtocharge!
	6:05pm Dave Miss: Good news?! I’m outta here.
	6:06pm melinda: Hi techtons
	🤖 6:07pm Webhamster Henry: I know about "loudhailer.io", a local company, which is a mesh network too. However they are really interested in pushing ads in your face.
	6:07pm Philippe bastille: Hi all
	6:07pm coelacanth∅))): greetings Mark & all
	🤖 6:07pm chresti: I just heard that someone figured out how to hack smart devices by shining a laser or flashlight at it, (at the speaker?) , and are able to order things, open doors, etc
	6:07pm queems: omg MARK i'm in mourning over my damn fitbit
	6:08pm Rand al'Thor: I prefer carrying around my PokeBall Pro to track my steps.
	6:08pm queems: thank you for addressing my sadness
	🤖 6:09pm chresti: haha queems
	🤖 6:09pm Webhamster Henry: I have an old fitbit, I stopped wearing it because it would zetz me when I would applaud. Repeated shaking was a signal to turn it on and off.
	6:09pm BigFreshMatt: Chresti- kind of. They can issue commands to the smart speaker using a laser. So they could issue commands from outside through a window.
	6:09pm Listener Robert: Do any of the links explain what the red and blue dots and blue lines on the map mean?
	6:10pm Daddy Hernlet: I've never liked using air BNB
	🤖 6:10pm chresti: !!!BigFreshMatt
	6:11pm queems: i've never used airb&b
	6:11pm Daddy Hernlet: And good evening techtonics!
	🤖 6:11pm chresti: Does anyone use Craigslist anymore?
	6:11pm BigFreshMatt: Guessing the red dots are antennae / repeaters and the blue lines indicates the line of sight to their “base”.
	6:11pm coelacanth∅))): she deserves to get scammed then. likewise uber users.
	6:12pm Rand al'Thor: The area where I live only really has Frontier/Verizon as an option.
	6:12pm Fuzzy: I use craigslist -- not airbnb though.
	6:12pm Ike: Jersey City residents, be sure to vote in the appropriate way on AirBNB tomorrow! NYC residents, please get out and vote YES on ballot question #1 tomorrow (if you haven't voted early) so that we can get ranked voting.
	6:12pm ultradamno: "Destiny is just another word for 'inevitable,' and nothing's inevitable as long as you stand up, look it in the eye, and say, 'You're evitable!'" -Fred, Angel
	6:12pm John from Florham park: @Chestri nit since I lived in South Florida
	6:12pm chris: hi, Mark and folks. i think the vice article was updated to say the FBI has contacted the journalist. so... at least there's that. then there's this: www.latimes.com...
	6:12pm BigFreshMatt: And I bet the blue dots are antennae with wired backhaul.
	6:13pm coelacanth∅))): chresti i use craigslist. you just have to sift through the bullshit and know how to recognise scams. ...i'm probably a little triggerhappy when it comes to shooting down scams!
	🤖 6:13pm Ken From Hyde Park: @chresti - Start spreading a story that someone's ventriloquist neighbor was opening their doors on them.
	6:13pm melinda: Airbnb allows me to stay in Jersey City for marathon and still cook my own food, which I need to do for health reasons. Too bad they suck.
	6:15pm coelacanth∅))): most communities have privately owned taxi services. i don't know why anyone would call uber when private taxi companies exist.
	6:16pm chris: i use juno when in nyc, when a cab can't be found
	6:16pm ultradamno: Well, as a term and/or condition, that's certainly a red flag. But is it enforceable?
	🤖 6:16pm chresti: coel, I use to enjoy perusing the free items, mostly junk, on craigslist
	6:17pm Listener Robert: The blue lines couldn't be lines of sight, because many more would exist than are drawn.
	6:17pm Zydeco Phil: Mark you should start one of these “community minded businesses”
	6:17pm Zydeco Phil: And perhaps run for office
	6:18pm coelacanth∅))): i list things for free on craigslist, but often the person who wants my free stuff isn't willing to meet me on my terms (in town) to pass the item(s) on to them. dipshits.
	6:18pm melinda: I use cabs, I hear some cities have crappy cab service but I think people generally do uber because it’s cheaper and not because service is better.
	6:19pm Ike: There's a bazillion entrepreneurs already. Shouldn't one of them be starting one of these ethical businesses? Don't make Mark do it.
	6:21pm queems: i solved this problem by not having internet in my apartment for the 6 years i lived there
	6:21pm debt collector: What is their legal structure? Co-op?
	6:22pm coelacanth∅))): i've asked a few uber users how much their rides cost them and so far they've always ranged from the same rate as a privately owned taxi service or a little more expensive. maybe it depends on location.
	6:22pm P-90: Ohhh... “mesh” organizers, not “meth” organizers. Read the title line on the app wrong, that’s what I get for joining 20 minutes late...
	6:23pm Ike: NYC residents, NOTE, if you can't get NYC Mesh: When it was called Time Warner (Slime Warner), Spectrum behaved so badly that the government forced them to offer a bargain plan for $14.99/month. It's NEVER marketed. You must ASK FOR IT. It's perfectly fine for most uses, at least for a single person who's not torrenting shit all the time.
	🤖 6:23pm chresti: Haha P-90
	6:23pm ignatatus666: I work for a private fleet taxi service in the City of Peekskill. We are licensed through the local Police Department. Vehicles inspected 2x per year. Drivers fingerprinted,photographed, federal background check and drug tested. Uber/Lyft? Nope. Also our local rates are regulated by the City of Peekskill. Uber/Lyft? Nope.
	6:24pm debt collector: Who is providing the back haul for nyc mesh?
	6:24pm melinda: @coel some people must think it’s just better if it uses an app. Or they are young enough that making a phone call to a cab company is scary.
	6:24pm Listener Robert: What the guest just described is...how the Internet is supposed to work!
	🤖 6:25pm Folsom: Do you get a routable ethernet address or is everyone behind a NAT with NYC Mesh?
	🤖 6:25pm chresti: I fear the big guys will try to shut you down
	6:25pm geezerette: Ike & Ignatus666; clap,clap,clap,clap!!! :D
	6:27pm geezerette: chresti, same. :[
	6:27pm coelacanth∅))): Iggy666 you aren't the cabby i ran into a week or so ago on main street in new paltz who pointed out my fmu shirt and told me about meeting Michele and Frangry, are you?
	6:28pm P-90: What?! “No required payment”? Isn’t that socialism or something?
	6:28pm Mandy: Uber was a godsend when it came about. when I lived in the city back in 2006-2011 I had so many bad cab experiences. They would fight with each other and scream at me to get into their cab. they would drive away if I said I wanted to go to Brooklyn, or screamed at me the whole time to Brooklyn. they wouldn't pick me up when I was with my trans friends. cabs weren't that great back then, in my experience.
	6:29pm queems: this is great!!! come to new jersey
	6:30pm Ike: @melinda@6:24, indeed, I hate talking to people on the phone. BUT, traditional NYC cabs have an app! Not that I use it -- I always take the subway anyway. The real issue is other cities, where smaller players like Juno don't operate....
	6:30pm queems: i should have stayed in astoria wtf
	6:30pm Listener Robert: What Uber and Lyft are to do is make more efficient use of existing capacity. So many people have cars they aren't driving most of the time, and so many of them have time to drive, it makes sense to save resources that way. Eventually with self-driving cars there'll be fewer cars around, because why own one and keep it parked during all those hours you aren't using them? So there'll be the equivalent of Uber and Lyft, just without drivers. Uber and Lyft are the intermediate stage toward this future.
	6:31pm P-90: @Mandy: That’s odd, when I’m in Brooklyn with my trans friends, everybody’s trying to pick us up...
	🤖 6:32pm chresti: The first time I visited NYC, there was a big cab strike, in 1978 or 79
	6:32pm Mandy: Again my experience was pre-uber. It felt like there was no accountability.
	🤖 6:33pm Webhamster Henry: I used to get in the cab first (with the kids) before telling the driver to go to Brooklyn.
	6:33pm coelacanth∅))): Mandy that's unfortunately true in nyc, probably very often. my sister has refused to leave a cab when brooklyn was refused. she and the driver sat there for almost an hour once (or over? -i wasn't there) the law says they must take you there.
	🤖 6:34pm chresti: Just like in the movies, Webham
	6:34pm Mandy: @Henry, yeah me too but because I was a young woman I had many of them scream at or chide me the entire time. It was unbelievable. I was so happy when they finally had a competitor.
	🤖 6:34pm Webhamster Henry: Lyft and Uber are up here in Kingston, but there are so few drivers neither is a real service in any sense of the word.
	🤖 6:34pm Ken From Hyde Park: Mafia, plenty of mafia in NYC.
	6:35pm geezerette: Feel the same about wind, solar, and gardening; love it to be i every neighborhood across the continent. Rain barrels where workable also. ( etc. )
	6:35pm melinda: More municipal fiber everywhere!
	6:36pm Glenn: City administrator here in the process of trying to deploy a free wireless network to residents. Even we don’t have access to the right of way to lay fiber
	6:36pm geezerette: Gotta re-think, re-make, re-do everything differently.
	6:36pm JakeGould: @ListenerRober: Uber and Lyft do not make a profit. Their whole purpose in existence is to stay alive long enough to get rid of municipal taxi rules and regulations so they control the system. They do not want to pay taxes and will not put personal safety first. Their goal is to disrupt the system so they benefit. TLC might be slow to act and change, but without them workers will be treated like crap, riders will not be as well protected, and all the $$$ they make will be sent to the corporate staff of those companies. Workers rights are never given and Uber and Lyft will not do that without regulation.
	6:38pm chris: if we don't vote out the corrupt politicians who are getting richer on lobbying efforts for privatization of utilities, we'll never get widespread municipal utilities back. so please vote.
	🤖 6:38pm chresti: Haha Mark
	6:38pm JakeGould: I did early voting in NYC.
	6:38pm Mandy: In NYC now I use the NYC Cab app, which is a great alternative. It supports pro-union organizations but also holds individual drivers accountable for their behavior. I haven't had a problem with anyone when using it.
	🤖 6:38pm Webhamster Henry: Fiber would be nice, but getting other providers in the media consolidated world would be tough! Especially when startups' business plan is 1) do somethig 2) attract attention 3) get acquired 4) $$$$
	6:40pm teod: hey nyc mesh, any comment on guifi in spain?
	6:40pm JakeGould: On topic: I think NYC Mesh is a great idea. But right now it seems like the density is really only in an odd mix of neighborhoods,. I mean, the mapitself shows mainly a “hipster” and gentrified bent to locations. Get
	6:40pm teod: also, any thought into a trans-hudson link to jersey?
	6:41pm Listener Robert: @JakeGould, if Uber and Lyft got rid of the regs, how could they control the system? Indeed there'd be no system to control!
	6:42pm coelacanth∅))): "go" shen.
	6:42pm Tommy in Neversink: Goshen.....long O
	6:42pm queems: “5 minutes if something”
	6:42pm queems: “of”
	6:43pm geezerette: hahaha, :)
	6:46pm Listener Robert: If you're relying on volunteers, you're going to get them where they are. I'm sure that's true of WFMU as well. If hipsters are overrepresented, that may be because they're more community spirited and of such age as to be capable of it.
	6:47pm JakeGould: Well, in response to the on air response to my question/statement: I live in deepish Brooklyn and honestly I support what Mesh NYC is doing, but I can’t easily see this spreading outside of a very specific slice of this city. The local politics is toxic out here so I wish them luck!
	6:48pm Carmichael: Speaking of Fitbits, I was mowing the lawn while wearing my Apple Watch. It apparently called 911 about 10 times. It must have been the vibration of the mower? Strange ...
	6:50pm JakeGould: I zoomed in on the map to Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights and the poorer/Chinese part of Sunset Park and there is literally only one node in deep Bay Ridge. I know things grow up hey… I know and respect but just saying!
	6:50pm P-90: Is this the night that “NYC Rainbarrels” is founded?
	6:51pm geezerette: :)
	6:51pm geezerette: Hi, P-90!
	6:51pm JakeGould: @Carmichael: I sold my Apple Watch. I wear my watches on my left arm and whenever I did work that bent my hand, it would push the crown and take screenshots. Could be similar to you!
	🤖 6:52pm chresti: We need LA Rainbarrels
	🤖 6:53pm Ken From Hyde Park: ...and rain to fill them
	6:53pm ignatatus666: @Coel No I work in the City of Peekskill Think Indian Point Power Plant. Although I go as far as the customers money goes. I can go anywhere at anytime overnight. My furthest trips were Boston and the upstate Cortlandt NY
	6:53pm geezerette: Chresti, for sure, and fog-catchers.
	🤖 6:55pm Ken From Hyde Park: The NFL football broadcast last night showed a panorama of the LA area. Looked like the air was thick with smog like the 70s.
	6:55pm geezerette: Mark, thanks for bringing Jillian & Scott. Nice to hear about "good "guys". :D
	6:55pm ignatatus666: Interested to know how Mesh would work in rural areas of Northern Westchester,Putnam and Dutchess.
	6:56pm coelacanth∅))): right on,Iggy. i should've asked him if he's on the comment boards, and what his handle is. we were walking in opposite directions though; both rushing a little...
	🤖 6:57pm chresti: Send some of the rain caught in the NYC Barrels to LA. geeze, hi!
	6:57pm northguineahills: Thanks Mark, Scott, and Jillian!
	6:57pm geezerette: Ken FHP: Likely lingering smoke but so much better than a week ago.
	6:58pm coelacanth∅))): Thanks Mark!
	6:59pm ignatatus666: Great show Always informative People in Peekskill and Putnam Valley are livid with cable monopolies for internet
	🤖 6:59pm Webhamster Henry: Back to Big Zucker next week! Thanks, Mark & Meshers!
	🤖 6:59pm chresti: Thanks Mark ! Jill and Scott, may the force be with you!
	6:59pm Dave Miss: Great news! Thanks!
	6:59pm P-90: “Build community and resist the Monoculture!”
	🤖 7:00pm chresti: There's hope I hope, after all
	7:01pm Philippe bastille: Thanks Mark
	7:01pm Listener Robert: I used to connect to the Internet by dialing in to volunteer BBSs that gated via UUCP to Usenet and e-mail. This is an update to that sort of thing.
	🤖 7:01pm Ken From Hyde Park: "Get off the entire Alphabet!" (Get it?)
	🤖 7:06pm Webhamster Henry: Yeah I did SLIP and PPP over dialup - there was an even more fragile methof that tunneled through telnet too. There were networks before the "Internet" like FIDO net for exchanging email too. AOL, CI$, and a bunch of other dialup services provided message boards and community before then - and still can.
	7:06pm WR: Interest to learn about NYC Mesh. Thinking about discussing this with my landlord makes me realize that the relationship has been basically me paying the rent and him shoveling the snow off the walk and tending to the yard. Doing NY Mesh would actually require we work together on something....scary in a good way...

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from November 4, 2019

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Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. In our shift to a digital future, we need alternatives to Big Tech. Homepage: techtonic.fm

Also available as an MP3 podcast. More info at our Podcast Central page.

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Upcoming events:

Mon. Nov 18th, 6pm - 7pm: Astronomer Samantha Lawler returns to Techtonic (More info...)
Thousands of Elon Musk's SpaceX satellites will re-enter Earth's atmosphere in the next few years, adding huge amounts of metals and chemicals to our atmosphere. Astronomer Samantha Lawler returns to Techtonic to explain why satellite "mega-constellations" are causing havoc for astronomers and will soon affect all life on earth.
Mon. Dec 23rd, 6pm - 7pm: Don Fleming guest hosts Techtonic

November 4, 2019: NYC Mesh, a community-owned network: Scott Rasmussen and Jillian Murphy

Listen to this show: Pop-up listen Pop-up player!

(Source: NYC Mesh)

Tonight we're talking about NYC Mesh, "a community-owned network," with organizers Scott Rasmussen and Jillian Murphy.

Pointers to NYC Mesh:

• NYC Mesh homepage: "NYC Mesh is a community-owned network that provides low-cost, fast internet service to individuals, businesses, offices, or entire buildings. Our mission is to create an open, resilient, and neutral network that is accessible and affordable to all New Yorkers." All for $20/month ("suggested membership contribution").

• We're connecting a whole block in Bed Stuy (Sep 24, 2019), by Willem, who writes how NYC Mesh worked with the 700 Jefferson Ave block association in Bed Stuy to "install six rooftop antenna locations that serve ten households - and counting." The new installations formed a "resilient mesh network. Now, if one antenna on the block went down, neighbors could still connect to the internet through another."

• Brief bio of Scott Rasmussen. Scott writes: "On October 19th we held our first-ever 'Install-a-thon' on Parkside Avenue in Brooklyn and connected 16 units in just one day through the local block association. We had 60 volunteers involved in the effort."

• Brief interview with Jillian Murphy: "I lead home installations, started organizing a monthly meeting, and write a newsletter for members."

• How We're Connecting Neighbors (Oct 31, 2018) by Ehud. "Since our block network is part of NYC Mesh, it's connected straight to the Internet 'backbone,' bypassing the commercial ISPs. What this means: - Our connection speed isn't artificially throttled to hike the price - Our data isn't spied on or sold by corporate creeps. - We don't pay into the cable cartel, which means we don't fund their lobbying, advertising, lawyers, executive salaries, bonuses, and dividends. Instead we each donate a suggested $20/month per household so NYCMesh can maintain and grow the wider community infrastructure we rely on, and we extend this network by offering links to other network hubs."

Recent tech news:

• I Got Access to My Secret Consumer Score. Now You Can Get Yours, Too. (by Kashmir Hill in the NYT, today, Nov 4). "As consumers, we all have 'secret scores.' ... [a company named] Sift does have a file on you, which it can produce upon request. I got mine, and I found it shocking: More than 400 pages long, it contained all the messages I’d ever sent to hosts on Airbnb; years of Yelp delivery orders; a log of every time I’d opened the Coinbase app on my iPhone... Sift knew, for example, that I’d used my iPhone to order chicken tikka masala, vegetable samosas and garlic naan on a Saturday night in April three years ago." (Thanks to Webhamster Henry, who writes that soon enough "AI will be eating this data and not need to keep it around, so it'll be assigning you categories used by customer services (or other services) that cannot be explained by human logic or accountability.")

• Also: Google bought Fitbit; AirBNB's scam on Tech Pie this morning; Block Sidewalk is working to resist the Google surveillance state in Toronto , and there's a collection of essays about it now; Lyft changed its terms and conditions; and Blade Runner and Running Man are coming due in 2019.

- - -

Check out techtonic.fm for recent Techtonic interviews and Little Slice of Tech Pie segments.

PODCAST: Subscribe to the Techtonic podcast

Artist	Track	Album	Label	Approx. start time
NYC Mesh provides high-speed Internet access without using Big Telecom companies. Organizers Scott Rasmussen and Jillian Murphy explain how it works.
Tomaš Dvořák	Game Boy Tune "Game Boy Tune" by "Tomaš Dvořák"	Machinarium Soundtrack	No label
	Mark's intro "Mark's intro"
	Interview with NYC Mesh organizers "Interview with NYC Mesh organizers"			0:13:48 (Pop-up)
	Your comments "Your comments"			0:35:39 (Pop-up)
Pink Tiles	Internet "Internet" by "Pink Tiles"	#1 Fan	The Pink Tiles	0:55:54 (Pop-up)

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Listener comments!
	6:01pm Fredericks: Hello, Technoids.
	6:01pm ultradamno: Hello Mark! Techton'r Treaters!
	6:02pm Rand al'Thor: I'm actually in the chat for once. Good evening, all!
	6:02pm John from Florham park: Hello fellow technoids
	🤖 6:02pm chresti: Hi Mark and Techtoniclandia!
	6:02pm geezerette: Greetings, Mark and all!
	🤖 6:03pm Webhamster Henry: The tones of tech means it's time for another show!
	6:03pm Ike: Hi all!
	6:03pm queems: howdy mark, others
	6:03pm Carmichael: Heya Mark and Hour-Behinders.
	🤖 6:04pm Bas NL: Hi Mark! Techtonic-philes!
	6:04pm John from Florham park: @Queems howdy
	6:04pm Rand al'Thor: Yay, good news show!
	🤖 6:04pm Ken From Hyde Park: Yay, Mark! Put your Fitbit on and lead the Techtocharge!
	6:05pm Dave Miss: Good news?! I’m outta here.
	6:06pm melinda: Hi techtons
	🤖 6:07pm Webhamster Henry: I know about "loudhailer.io", a local company, which is a mesh network too. However they are really interested in pushing ads in your face.
	6:07pm Philippe bastille: Hi all
	6:07pm coelacanth∅))): greetings Mark & all
	🤖 6:07pm chresti: I just heard that someone figured out how to hack smart devices by shining a laser or flashlight at it, (at the speaker?) , and are able to order things, open doors, etc
	6:07pm queems: omg MARK i'm in mourning over my damn fitbit
	6:08pm Rand al'Thor: I prefer carrying around my PokeBall Pro to track my steps.
	6:08pm queems: thank you for addressing my sadness
	🤖 6:09pm chresti: haha queems
	🤖 6:09pm Webhamster Henry: I have an old fitbit, I stopped wearing it because it would zetz me when I would applaud. Repeated shaking was a signal to turn it on and off.
	6:09pm BigFreshMatt: Chresti- kind of. They can issue commands to the smart speaker using a laser. So they could issue commands from outside through a window.
	6:09pm Listener Robert: Do any of the links explain what the red and blue dots and blue lines on the map mean?
	6:10pm Daddy Hernlet: I've never liked using air BNB
	🤖 6:10pm chresti: !!!BigFreshMatt
	6:11pm queems: i've never used airb&b
	6:11pm Daddy Hernlet: And good evening techtonics!
	🤖 6:11pm chresti: Does anyone use Craigslist anymore?
	6:11pm BigFreshMatt: Guessing the red dots are antennae / repeaters and the blue lines indicates the line of sight to their “base”.
	6:11pm coelacanth∅))): she deserves to get scammed then. likewise uber users.
	6:12pm Rand al'Thor: The area where I live only really has Frontier/Verizon as an option.
	6:12pm Fuzzy: I use craigslist -- not airbnb though.
	6:12pm Ike: Jersey City residents, be sure to vote in the appropriate way on AirBNB tomorrow! NYC residents, please get out and vote YES on ballot question #1 tomorrow (if you haven't voted early) so that we can get ranked voting.
	6:12pm ultradamno: "Destiny is just another word for 'inevitable,' and nothing's inevitable as long as you stand up, look it in the eye, and say, 'You're evitable!'" -Fred, Angel
	6:12pm John from Florham park: @Chestri nit since I lived in South Florida
	6:12pm chris: hi, Mark and folks. i think the vice article was updated to say the FBI has contacted the journalist. so... at least there's that. then there's this: www.latimes.com...
	6:12pm BigFreshMatt: And I bet the blue dots are antennae with wired backhaul.
	6:13pm coelacanth∅))): chresti i use craigslist. you just have to sift through the bullshit and know how to recognise scams. ...i'm probably a little triggerhappy when it comes to shooting down scams!
	🤖 6:13pm Ken From Hyde Park: @chresti - Start spreading a story that someone's ventriloquist neighbor was opening their doors on them.
	6:13pm melinda: Airbnb allows me to stay in Jersey City for marathon and still cook my own food, which I need to do for health reasons. Too bad they suck.
	6:15pm coelacanth∅))): most communities have privately owned taxi services. i don't know why anyone would call uber when private taxi companies exist.
	6:16pm chris: i use juno when in nyc, when a cab can't be found
	6:16pm ultradamno: Well, as a term and/or condition, that's certainly a red flag. But is it enforceable?
	🤖 6:16pm chresti: coel, I use to enjoy perusing the free items, mostly junk, on craigslist
	6:17pm Listener Robert: The blue lines couldn't be lines of sight, because many more would exist than are drawn.
	6:17pm Zydeco Phil: Mark you should start one of these “community minded businesses”
	6:17pm Zydeco Phil: And perhaps run for office
	6:18pm coelacanth∅))): i list things for free on craigslist, but often the person who wants my free stuff isn't willing to meet me on my terms (in town) to pass the item(s) on to them. dipshits.
	6:18pm melinda: I use cabs, I hear some cities have crappy cab service but I think people generally do uber because it’s cheaper and not because service is better.
	6:19pm Ike: There's a bazillion entrepreneurs already. Shouldn't one of them be starting one of these ethical businesses? Don't make Mark do it.
	6:21pm queems: i solved this problem by not having internet in my apartment for the 6 years i lived there
	6:21pm debt collector: What is their legal structure? Co-op?
	6:22pm coelacanth∅))): i've asked a few uber users how much their rides cost them and so far they've always ranged from the same rate as a privately owned taxi service or a little more expensive. maybe it depends on location.
	6:22pm P-90: Ohhh... “mesh” organizers, not “meth” organizers. Read the title line on the app wrong, that’s what I get for joining 20 minutes late...
	6:23pm Ike: NYC residents, NOTE, if you can't get NYC Mesh: When it was called Time Warner (Slime Warner), Spectrum behaved so badly that the government forced them to offer a bargain plan for $14.99/month. It's NEVER marketed. You must ASK FOR IT. It's perfectly fine for most uses, at least for a single person who's not torrenting shit all the time.
	🤖 6:23pm chresti: Haha P-90
	6:23pm ignatatus666: I work for a private fleet taxi service in the City of Peekskill. We are licensed through the local Police Department. Vehicles inspected 2x per year. Drivers fingerprinted,photographed, federal background check and drug tested. Uber/Lyft? Nope. Also our local rates are regulated by the City of Peekskill. Uber/Lyft? Nope.
	6:24pm debt collector: Who is providing the back haul for nyc mesh?
	6:24pm melinda: @coel some people must think it’s just better if it uses an app. Or they are young enough that making a phone call to a cab company is scary.
	6:24pm Listener Robert: What the guest just described is...how the Internet is supposed to work!
	🤖 6:25pm Folsom: Do you get a routable ethernet address or is everyone behind a NAT with NYC Mesh?
	🤖 6:25pm chresti: I fear the big guys will try to shut you down
	6:25pm geezerette: Ike & Ignatus666; clap,clap,clap,clap!!! :D
	6:27pm geezerette: chresti, same. :[
	6:27pm coelacanth∅))): Iggy666 you aren't the cabby i ran into a week or so ago on main street in new paltz who pointed out my fmu shirt and told me about meeting Michele and Frangry, are you?
	6:28pm P-90: What?! “No required payment”? Isn’t that socialism or something?
	6:28pm Mandy: Uber was a godsend when it came about. when I lived in the city back in 2006-2011 I had so many bad cab experiences. They would fight with each other and scream at me to get into their cab. they would drive away if I said I wanted to go to Brooklyn, or screamed at me the whole time to Brooklyn. they wouldn't pick me up when I was with my trans friends. cabs weren't that great back then, in my experience.
	6:29pm queems: this is great!!! come to new jersey
	6:30pm Ike: @melinda@6:24, indeed, I hate talking to people on the phone. BUT, traditional NYC cabs have an app! Not that I use it -- I always take the subway anyway. The real issue is other cities, where smaller players like Juno don't operate....
	6:30pm queems: i should have stayed in astoria wtf
	6:30pm Listener Robert: What Uber and Lyft are to do is make more efficient use of existing capacity. So many people have cars they aren't driving most of the time, and so many of them have time to drive, it makes sense to save resources that way. Eventually with self-driving cars there'll be fewer cars around, because why own one and keep it parked during all those hours you aren't using them? So there'll be the equivalent of Uber and Lyft, just without drivers. Uber and Lyft are the intermediate stage toward this future.
	6:31pm P-90: @Mandy: That’s odd, when I’m in Brooklyn with my trans friends, everybody’s trying to pick us up...
	🤖 6:32pm chresti: The first time I visited NYC, there was a big cab strike, in 1978 or 79
	6:32pm Mandy: Again my experience was pre-uber. It felt like there was no accountability.
	🤖 6:33pm Webhamster Henry: I used to get in the cab first (with the kids) before telling the driver to go to Brooklyn.
	6:33pm coelacanth∅))): Mandy that's unfortunately true in nyc, probably very often. my sister has refused to leave a cab when brooklyn was refused. she and the driver sat there for almost an hour once (or over? -i wasn't there) the law says they must take you there.
	🤖 6:34pm chresti: Just like in the movies, Webham
	6:34pm Mandy: @Henry, yeah me too but because I was a young woman I had many of them scream at or chide me the entire time. It was unbelievable. I was so happy when they finally had a competitor.
	🤖 6:34pm Webhamster Henry: Lyft and Uber are up here in Kingston, but there are so few drivers neither is a real service in any sense of the word.
	🤖 6:34pm Ken From Hyde Park: Mafia, plenty of mafia in NYC.
	6:35pm geezerette: Feel the same about wind, solar, and gardening; love it to be i every neighborhood across the continent. Rain barrels where workable also. ( etc. )
	6:35pm melinda: More municipal fiber everywhere!
	6:36pm Glenn: City administrator here in the process of trying to deploy a free wireless network to residents. Even we don’t have access to the right of way to lay fiber
	6:36pm geezerette: Gotta re-think, re-make, re-do everything differently.
	6:36pm JakeGould: @ListenerRober: Uber and Lyft do not make a profit. Their whole purpose in existence is to stay alive long enough to get rid of municipal taxi rules and regulations so they control the system. They do not want to pay taxes and will not put personal safety first. Their goal is to disrupt the system so they benefit. TLC might be slow to act and change, but without them workers will be treated like crap, riders will not be as well protected, and all the $$$ they make will be sent to the corporate staff of those companies. Workers rights are never given and Uber and Lyft will not do that without regulation.
	6:38pm chris: if we don't vote out the corrupt politicians who are getting richer on lobbying efforts for privatization of utilities, we'll never get widespread municipal utilities back. so please vote.
	🤖 6:38pm chresti: Haha Mark
	6:38pm JakeGould: I did early voting in NYC.
	6:38pm Mandy: In NYC now I use the NYC Cab app, which is a great alternative. It supports pro-union organizations but also holds individual drivers accountable for their behavior. I haven't had a problem with anyone when using it.
	🤖 6:38pm Webhamster Henry: Fiber would be nice, but getting other providers in the media consolidated world would be tough! Especially when startups' business plan is 1) do somethig 2) attract attention 3) get acquired 4) $$$$
	6:40pm teod: hey nyc mesh, any comment on guifi in spain?
	6:40pm JakeGould: On topic: I think NYC Mesh is a great idea. But right now it seems like the density is really only in an odd mix of neighborhoods,. I mean, the mapitself shows mainly a “hipster” and gentrified bent to locations. Get
	6:40pm teod: also, any thought into a trans-hudson link to jersey?
	6:41pm Listener Robert: @JakeGould, if Uber and Lyft got rid of the regs, how could they control the system? Indeed there'd be no system to control!
	6:42pm coelacanth∅))): "go" shen.
	6:42pm Tommy in Neversink: Goshen.....long O
	6:42pm queems: “5 minutes if something”
	6:42pm queems: “of”
	6:43pm geezerette: hahaha, :)
	6:46pm Listener Robert: If you're relying on volunteers, you're going to get them where they are. I'm sure that's true of WFMU as well. If hipsters are overrepresented, that may be because they're more community spirited and of such age as to be capable of it.
	6:47pm JakeGould: Well, in response to the on air response to my question/statement: I live in deepish Brooklyn and honestly I support what Mesh NYC is doing, but I can’t easily see this spreading outside of a very specific slice of this city. The local politics is toxic out here so I wish them luck!
	6:48pm Carmichael: Speaking of Fitbits, I was mowing the lawn while wearing my Apple Watch. It apparently called 911 about 10 times. It must have been the vibration of the mower? Strange ...
	6:50pm JakeGould: I zoomed in on the map to Bay Ridge, Dyker Heights and the poorer/Chinese part of Sunset Park and there is literally only one node in deep Bay Ridge. I know things grow up hey… I know and respect but just saying!
	6:50pm P-90: Is this the night that “NYC Rainbarrels” is founded?
	6:51pm geezerette: :)
	6:51pm geezerette: Hi, P-90!
	6:51pm JakeGould: @Carmichael: I sold my Apple Watch. I wear my watches on my left arm and whenever I did work that bent my hand, it would push the crown and take screenshots. Could be similar to you!
	🤖 6:52pm chresti: We need LA Rainbarrels
	🤖 6:53pm Ken From Hyde Park: ...and rain to fill them
	6:53pm ignatatus666: @Coel No I work in the City of Peekskill Think Indian Point Power Plant. Although I go as far as the customers money goes. I can go anywhere at anytime overnight. My furthest trips were Boston and the upstate Cortlandt NY
	6:53pm geezerette: Chresti, for sure, and fog-catchers.
	🤖 6:55pm Ken From Hyde Park: The NFL football broadcast last night showed a panorama of the LA area. Looked like the air was thick with smog like the 70s.
	6:55pm geezerette: Mark, thanks for bringing Jillian & Scott. Nice to hear about "good "guys". :D
	6:55pm ignatatus666: Interested to know how Mesh would work in rural areas of Northern Westchester,Putnam and Dutchess.
	6:56pm coelacanth∅))): right on,Iggy. i should've asked him if he's on the comment boards, and what his handle is. we were walking in opposite directions though; both rushing a little...
	🤖 6:57pm chresti: Send some of the rain caught in the NYC Barrels to LA. geeze, hi!
	6:57pm northguineahills: Thanks Mark, Scott, and Jillian!
	6:57pm geezerette: Ken FHP: Likely lingering smoke but so much better than a week ago.
	6:58pm coelacanth∅))): Thanks Mark!
	6:59pm ignatatus666: Great show Always informative People in Peekskill and Putnam Valley are livid with cable monopolies for internet
	🤖 6:59pm Webhamster Henry: Back to Big Zucker next week! Thanks, Mark & Meshers!
	🤖 6:59pm chresti: Thanks Mark ! Jill and Scott, may the force be with you!
	6:59pm Dave Miss: Great news! Thanks!
	6:59pm P-90: “Build community and resist the Monoculture!”
	🤖 7:00pm chresti: There's hope I hope, after all
	7:01pm Philippe bastille: Thanks Mark
	7:01pm Listener Robert: I used to connect to the Internet by dialing in to volunteer BBSs that gated via UUCP to Usenet and e-mail. This is an update to that sort of thing.
	🤖 7:01pm Ken From Hyde Park: "Get off the entire Alphabet!" (Get it?)
	🤖 7:06pm Webhamster Henry: Yeah I did SLIP and PPP over dialup - there was an even more fragile methof that tunneled through telnet too. There were networks before the "Internet" like FIDO net for exchanging email too. AOL, CI$, and a bunch of other dialup services provided message boards and community before then - and still can.
	7:06pm WR: Interest to learn about NYC Mesh. Thinking about discussing this with my landlord makes me realize that the relationship has been basically me paying the rent and him shoveling the snow off the walk and tending to the yard. Doing NY Mesh would actually require we work together on something....scary in a good way...

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from November 4, 2019

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