WFMU: Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from May 1, 2023

Listener comments!
	6:00pm ultradamno: Mark! Mandltons!
	6:01pm G: Should be interesting...
	6:01pm Rolando: Good morning Friends. Finally I’m on time and on the right day, I’m speaking about myself. I’m looking forward to the show.
	🤖 6:02pm PaulRobeson1923: Morninggggggggggggg
	6:02pm G: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:02 Morning where? S Korea?
	6:04pm efd: not sure how you snagged this guest but well done!
	6:05pm Carmichael: I've heard of this guy.
	🤖 6:05pm DjLorraine: Most important hour in current history, hey radio neighbors
	🤖 6:05pm chresti: Hi Mark and Dave and techtonians!
	6:05pm Ciggy: PROG / TECH
	🤖 6:05pm Handy Haversack: Mark! Techyons! Dave!
	🤖 6:06pm Bas NL: Hi mark! Hi Techtonicies!
	6:06pm Peter from Boonton formerly Dover NJ: Good evening Mark, Dave, and techies.
	🤖 6:06pm Ken From Hyde Park: Hello and welcome to punch card talk!
	6:07pm G: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:06 Or, yellow tape with holes in it, early 1970s.
	6:07pm Jackie G: Hope Dave sticks around for It's Complicated.
	🤖 6:07pm Handy Haversack: ↳ efd @6:04 Fortune favors the bold, efd!
	6:07pm T GRavel: Hi David and Mark !
	6:07pm Marie in Queens: I like to think I am a frand of all the DJs @) Hey everybody.
	6:08pm ultradamno: Last night's John Oliver piece on immigration had an interesting sidebar of interest to this show (the disastrous app for scheduling asylum hearings)
	🤖 6:08pm PaulRobeson1923: WHAT ACCOUNTS FOR HISTORICAL CHANGE
	🤖 6:09pm Handy Haversack: I used to be kind of jealous of my friends who went into tech. They just have so much more money than we have. Now I mainly pity them. And wish they'd stop doing this to the rest of us.
	6:09pm dale: i worked in design and then advertising. you get promoted and when they need to cut costs they look from the top down to cut. i can't imagine trying to age out in that game today.
	6:09pm Jackie G: ↳ ultradamno @6:08 John Oliver's show is great. Mark reference's it on occasion
	6:10pm Carmichael: When will Skynet become aware??
	6:10pm Juli: Good evening:::}}}
	6:10pm P-90: Hurst + Mandl. Clash of the Titans.
	🤖 6:10pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Carmichael @6:10 Eh, when it stops raining.
	🤖 6:11pm Webhamster Henry: Hi Davem! Dave was part of the original WFMU-gets-on-the-Internet project.
	6:12pm ultradamno: Well, weather radar won't help against the constant bird attacks anyway.
	6:12pm morphe': ↳ P-90 @6:10 Hurst + Mandl = Tag Team Gentle Giants ... working for the good of HumanKind...
	6:12pm Peter from Boonton formerly Dover NJ: LOLZ, I sat in an airplane for 3 hours b4 takeoff while the pilots re-installed a critical database. Same trip, I was on an in-country trip in China where plane was diverted bigly due to typhoon.
	🤖 6:12pm chresti: Boy I hate flying
	6:13pm Fredericks: Dee Plane, Dee plane!
	6:13pm HollyRT: Oh God, this story. Worst nightmare
	6:13pm Sam: This is why we need high speed rail!!
	🤖 6:13pm Handy Haversack: ↳ morphe' @6:12 Yeah, play Gentle Giant!
	🤖 6:14pm DjLorraine: Anyone see Roy Wood Jr at correspondants dinner?
	6:14pm Jackie G: Half way home the plane ran out of gas. Had to turn around and get more gas,
	6:14pm morphe': Bag count = no bag on the plane unless it is connected to a person on the plane ... an actual good anti-bomb regulation ...
	🤖 6:15pm DjLorraine: Weights and balances. I worked baggage for AA
	6:15pm Jeff Golick: This airplane story is giving me PTSD.
	6:15pm ultradamno: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Only part I did watch, he did reasonably well, it's not any comedians ideal audience.
	6:15pm Marie in Queens: What a nightmare
	🤖 6:16pm PaulRobeson1923: McArthur!
	6:16pm Ciggy: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Yes. He was biting & always introspective
	6:16pm Jackie G: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:15 Is this a bad dream or a real story?
	🤖 6:17pm Handy Haversack: Take MARTA. It's smarta.
	6:17pm dale: i highly recommend bethlehem as an overnight. nice bars and the cooling towers for the steel mills are super cool.
	🤖 6:17pm DjLorraine: ↳ ultradamno @6:15 Exactly. Having to make light of serious situations that they try to get people to address.
	6:18pm Sam: Doesn’t the airline have to put you up?
	6:18pm Rolando: Just sharing my thoughts : For what it’s worth I manage 1600+ devices (1400 students and teachers) for this school on the Sunshine Coast, Australia http://glasshouse.QLD.edu.au. In its getting tricky ethically, after 18 years of service I’m torn between surveillance, monitoring, cloud services, sharing data, protecting students and parents and data. Knowing and understanding where tech is headed if we allow it to travel unrestricted to where the “tech bro’s” are headed is wearing on the mind. Thanks Mark for all you do!
	6:18pm ultradamno: ↳ ultradamno @6:15 And the MET gala is going on now, they should find a way to consolidate the two events twitter.com...
	6:18pm Marie in Queens: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 I heard one excerpt about that gajillionire "buying" Clarence Thomas--powerfull. I'm gonna find his whole monologue. I love listening to those
	6:19pm G: You can do anything you want on the internet, as long as it's what they want to let you do.
	6:19pm Juli: I'm never getting on a plane again haha shite I have nightmares about it haha
	6:19pm Jackie G: Kinda feeling bad for Dave right now.
	🤖 6:19pm chresti: You'd go, I'd go "postal"!
	6:19pm patrick321: My niece had somewhat less of a nightmare going to San Diego from Newark and I saw a couple of similar play by plays on the tweeter about the air travel nightmare yesterday.
	6:20pm StringOFperils: The algorithm says it's time for you to stay calm and go for a long long walk.
	🤖 6:20pm Ken From Hyde Park: The airline - hotel - ground transportation supply chain.
	6:21pm ike-o: There's nothing better than a jerk that gets technology
	🤖 6:22pm Webhamster Henry: I can always pull the line " Oh I used to write customer support consoles" if they seem to not think they can, say , escalate the problem.
	6:23pm Juli: I want to go to Japan::::: Dystopian futures
	6:23pm Marie in Queens: I think some of them are designed to put off customers so the business doesn't have to do anything and then they save $ (bastards)
	🤖 6:23pm Webhamster Henry: I hate the voice recognition IRV bots!
	6:23pm Jackie G: Press 1 for Englsh Press 2 for everything else Press zero for a real (kinda) person
	🤖 6:23pm chresti: ↳ ike-o @6:21 My son's like that- he'll call a car rental place to get me a better deal by reading them the riot act.
	6:24pm HollyRT: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:23 100%
	🤖 6:24pm Webhamster Henry: What I often get is " I'll transfer you to another department" -- CLICK.
	6:24pm ultradamno: Apple's customer support seems to be 'your answer can be found only by going on a search engine easter egg hunt...good luck!"
	6:24pm Marie in Queens: And worst of all is how most companies now hide their phone numbers or are virtually unreachable
	🤖 6:25pm chresti: I hate AI customer service, it always hangs up on me.
	🤖 6:25pm MarciB: This convo is so righteous!
	🤖 6:25pm Ken From Hyde Park: Press the star key to speak with a ChatGTP bot.
	6:26pm dale: my wife works in a bank. half her day is dealing with old people who don't WANT to look up their balances on a computer or phone and just want to come in to visit because they are lonely. and then she gets yelled at for not doing more cold calls to sell whatever product they want pushed at that moment.
	6:27pm dale: ....but they bring candy or donuts for the bank employees. which is bizarre to me.
	6:27pm ultradamno: Xfinity is worse...there's no hope of getting a person any more it's automated 'we're sending a pulse' wait many hours and call back for the same message if it doesn't work.
	6:27pm Chris Hiatt: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:17 What was that high speed train option from Neuromancer? The BAMA? That's what I want to take!
	6:28pm that girl from that place: They do not do that any more at aircanada unfortunately
	🤖 6:28pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Chris Hiatt @6:27 We've slid past Neuromancer on the dystopia scale.
	6:28pm Lee B: Similar story Mark but a very different outcome. 2 weeks ago I was traveling from Tokyo to LGA with my son. We got to LA and were going to miss our connection through Chicago, so I rebooked, but the only flights were the next day. Exhausted we resigned to that, and signed up for a flight to Chi and then back to NY the next morning, but the agent booked my 16 yo son and I on separate flights. I got loud and said I'm going to have to speak to your manager. The agent basically thanked me and said, we only have access to some info, but the managers can make bigger changes! We were quickly booked on a direct flight to JFK and came out almost unscathed.
	🤖 6:29pm Webhamster Henry: Well you know, no human, no need to pay health care. So: Universal Health care will let more people be employed!
	6:29pm Sam: You’ve got to stop giving these companies your business. If they lose enough business the market will correct itself. People have to stop putting up with this.
	6:29pm G: I, Underling to Robots
	6:30pm StringOFperils: I Roadblock
	6:31pm Ciggy: There. Right there. Dave said it, "it's Complicated."
	6:31pm Niall: I'm trying to recover an old Instagram account that's tied to a phone number I no longer have. I've uploaded selfie videos like eight times and they've rejected every attempt with no additional recourse. All I wanna do is see pictures of my old dog....
	🤖 6:31pm Handy Haversack: Dave is getting at the crux -- the "digital transformation" has always been profoundly antilabor, just like all other capitalist "revolutions," which are better described as consolidations -- especially in the more and more wealth concentrated in a smaller field of humans. You cannot preserve the tech economic system in any way like it's been established without continuing its crushinh antilabor, antihuman ways. It has to be overturned entirely and tech put in the service of the people. Not the other way round.
	🤖 6:31pm Webhamster Henry: in re: diagnose the problem with your car: This Bot has been trained on 30 years of "Car Talk".
	6:31pm Jeff Golick: ↳ Ciggy @6:31 Ha!
	6:31pm Ciggy: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:28 New Rose Hotel
	🤖 6:32pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 *crushing
	🤖 6:32pm Webhamster Henry: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 Good to point out on May 1st!
	6:32pm Ike: Ah, the grim state of my field…
	🤖 6:33pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:32 Ha, right! Though needful to point out every day.
	6:33pm coelacanth∅: hey it works for the 1%
	🤖 6:34pm PaulRobeson1923: What happens when few people care about the typos and the computers have a pistol?
	6:34pm StringOFperils: AI says, "Have a nice trip. Nice knowing you." ideas.ted.com...
	6:34pm DanFA: Brazilesque
	6:34pm Jeff Golick: This is the thing with AI/bots - they make errors constantly and the tech folks will simply, shamelessly make the case that this is somehow fine. The bots will make the same case, presumably.
	6:34pm ultradamno: At least Brazil had pneumatic tubes
	🤖 6:34pm Handy Haversack: "Share and enjoy."
	6:34pm Carmichael: The good news is that computers will do exactly what they are told. The bad news is that computers will do excactly what they're told.
	6:34pm Dano59: First they came for the copy editors, and I did not speak out. Than they caym 4 da riters an I coudn unnestan anythin i was reedin
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ ultradamno @6:34 And an active rebellion!
	6:35pm G: Kafka worked for years compiling reports and portfolios in the labor disability bureaucracy of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. So much inspiration!
	6:35pm HollyRT: ↳ Sam @6:29 You know there are only like five companies now, right?
	6:35pm Fredericks: Cheap. Fast. Good. You can choose only two. When it comes to A.I., it seems like the companies are choosing same two over and over and it ain't good.
	6:35pm Carmichael: And Central Services.
	🤖 6:35pm chresti: The money bags are far removed from the suffering- they only look at the numbers..
	6:35pm Dano59: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:34 typos happen in code and that may be the crux of the problem
	6:36pm Chris Hiatt: Time Trout!
	🤖 6:36pm PaulRobeson1923: ↳ Dano59 @6:35 How do we take the guns away from the Computers?
	🤖 6:37pm chresti: Oh wow LARB!
	6:37pm DanFA: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 You'll have to pry them from their cold metal claws.
	6:38pm G: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 Sorry, Dave, I'm afraid you can't do that.
	6:38pm StringOFperils: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 HALAR15ious!
	6:38pm ?: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Would've been better if he brought the rest of Wizzard with him
	🤖 6:38pm Handy Haversack: Buzzfeed tried to go with AI writers just before going out of business. I guess next time it will take. But the answer is partly that these media outlets have long since stopped serving the public good. Those organs that ARE trying to do so won't go down this road. Now, that might not let the signal penetrate the noise, but journalism that is imbricate with capitalism will never serve the public except clandestinely and on its extreme margins.
	6:38pm Marie in Queens: In a way (maybe many) it is in business's best interests to have a part part of the population who is just literate enough to be a docile consumer and docile worker
	6:39pm Marie in Queens: and won't notice/care about errors in writing
	🤖 6:39pm Handy Haversack: Bless writers who are also editors. I have worked on books by some journalists, and wow, their reliance on the copy desk is pretty clear!
	6:39pm ?: ↳ Sam @6:18 I got bumped off an AA flight for a service dog. F'ed up my whole vacation
	6:39pm Dano59: the Arthur C. Clarke story about inventory paperwork in space and an "offog" comes to mind
	6:40pm Ike: Oh, the bots will make copy-editing errors! The errors will be ones they’re aping from the source material that’s been input into the algorithm to “train” it — though admittedly they’ll be minimal.
	🤖 6:40pm DjLorraine: ↳ Jeff Golick @6:34 They mentioned that on npr today
	🤖 6:40pm Webhamster Henry: Editors will be needed to edit the ChatGPT article firehose.
	6:40pm efd: I'd also like to add that Dave takes some great photos, particularly of little-seen parts of Brooklyn, which he occasionally posts on his Mastodon account (@dmandl@mastodon.social)
	6:40pm Joe R.: I’m a recovering techie (nearly 30 years coding, 5 yrs user experience design) on an extended career break and I feel like I’m in the same boat as Dave—I don’t know that I’d take that path today.
	6:41pm Carmichael: ↳ @6:38 Hopefully he did "Angel Fingers".
	6:42pm dale: i moved into painting and drywall. artificial intelligence can't do that yet.
	6:43pm Jeff Golick: Read a book?? Look at Prof. Einstein over here.
	6:43pm Dano59: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:40 "ChatGPT fixer" becomes the new breed of copy editor. if only.
	🤖 6:43pm Webhamster Henry: Applications basically build themselves these days, even without Machine Learning. My contention for years is that someone will converse with an AI that will use those constantly revised specs to write the actual code - and the documentation and the instructions and make the tutorial videos.
	🤖 6:43pm Handy Haversack: Episode with interview with Carolyn Chen, author of /Work, Pray, Code/: www.wfmu.org...
	6:44pm Dano59: ... anyone see Bill Maher's slavish, fawning interview with Elon on Friday?
	6:45pm Marie in Queens: Are today's techies yesterday's engineers?
	6:45pm DanFA: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 Oh god. I unfortunately have.
	6:45pm Rolando: Newly “minted techies” is a perfect description for the advocates of technology.
	6:45pm efd: I'm not as hardcore as Dave but I did PC-based programming for about a decade in the mid '80s into the '90s. I had been an English major, and the guy who hired me into the IT dep't at my first regular corporate job had also been an English major. Never would have happened 10-15 years later, let alone today I don't think.
	6:46pm DanFA: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 He was practically drooling over Musk. Yes, please, tell us about the woke mind virus, daddy.
	🤖 6:46pm PaulRobeson1923: Eat, sleep, breath “tech” Bucky Fuller talks about over specialization leading to extinction in the Natural world- thank goodness we have better foresight than those stupid seed eating birds
	6:46pm ultradamno: I stopped with Maher altogether at some point during the pandemic (I think the final straw was that stupid Mao statuette)...regret not doing it sooner. He's just awful.
	🤖 6:47pm Webhamster Henry: ↳ efd @6:45 I have a B.A. in Computer Science and English. I think English majors will be hired in tech jobs because the bots will do the grunt work of coding, and the English majors will be lots cheaper than Comp Sci majors.
	6:47pm Dano59: my most maddening bad-vibe bout with tech "customer service" was in trying to finally cancel an Earthlink service that kept billing me after I'd canceled it. they insisted I call them and wait in voicemail hell for at least 90 minutes each time. no email recourse, no online form.
	🤖 6:47pm chresti: That's easy "Roses are red.." etc
	🤖 6:48pm Ken From Hyde Park: ↳ efd @6:45 Even if your code may have been suspect, at least it was well-commented.
	🤖 6:48pm DjLorraine: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 Yes
	🤖 6:48pm Webhamster Henry: Dave speaks for me about Tech Interviews. Some people get it, some people have a bunch of checkpoints.
	6:49pm full_english_breakfast: the live-coding / leetcode tech interview gauntlet... i hate it!
	6:49pm Layet Johnson: Who was it that said the only interview question should be to name a poem they’ve read? That’s wonderful. I’m thinking about some tech friends who are increasingly impossible to communicate with the older we get, the more I invest in art and the more they invest in tech :(
	6:49pm Niall: I haven't had to endure the Tech Interview, but I'm strongly considering a late-life career change. Lord knows what I'd do; I'm pretty much only good at one thing.
	6:50pm Dano59: ↳ DanFA @6:46 they shared lib-bashing common ground. He's still a loon and a fraud, albeit a rich one.
	6:50pm HollyRT: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 Gatekeeping on steroids
	6:50pm P-90: “WHAT are you trying to do…?!”
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: There is this mythological bunch of 200% effort guys that Elon thinks will work for him.
	🤖 6:50pm Bas NL: No knowledge, can not answer.
	🤖 6:51pm Handy Haversack: To work for the wrong companies doing wrong things for the benefit only of the owners. Rotten process, rotten outcome.
	🤖 6:51pm chresti: ↳ Dano59 @6:47 My son loves dealing with customer service like that to fix a problem like being over charged, etc
	6:51pm mespr: ↳ Layet Johnson @6:49 I was asked to recite a poem to get into college, for a philosophy major/ cs minor.
	🤖 6:51pm PaulRobeson1923: Buy a gun for your computer
	6:52pm Dano59: gollum over there reminds my of my friend in tech who referred to his first iPhone as "the Precious"
	6:52pm mespr: Institutions are teaching the unnecessary frameworks promoted by Google, Twitter and Facebook. It hides how attainable the core languages are. We don't need this. I completely ignore education history when I hire people... I just try working with them for a bit.
	6:52pm ultradamno: I did see where Musk said The Onion was now "jarringly unfunny" because 'woke isn't real'. Some backstory www.theverge.com...
	6:54pm ultradamno: ...or 'woke is a lie' rather, is the exact quote. From the man who cordially invited Trump back to Twitter
	6:54pm coelacanth∅: my one nephew would definitely high-five someone for shooting down a supposedly inferior applicant. arrogant douchebag who idolizes elon musk. not 20 minutes would pass in his company without him telling a story that included him saying he "was the smartest person there". ...obviously a stupid person.
	🤖 6:54pm Bas NL: 10 print "Is that all there is?" 20 goto 10
	🤖 6:54pm chresti: Haha cult fit
	6:54pm dale: i once interviewed at a place called notovitz and perrault, they did the mtv moon flag animation stuff. the woman just wanted to talk to me about what bars and clubs i went to. she said 'i have to like you before i hire you.' i said the pyramid and aztec lounge but never got a second interview.
	6:55pm Niall: chatgpt was a useful and helpful teacher with some stuff I don't know well, like XSLT. It falls apart quickly, but when it does its job well, it's well helpful. Like an interactive manpage.
	6:55pm HollyRT: ↳ ultradamno @6:52 That's rich coming from the unfunniest person in America.
	6:55pm Layet Johnson: Where’d you go @mespr? Very cool
	6:56pm JJ NY-SC: They want to know if you'll go drinking with them after work.
	6:56pm Dano59: I went from six years in computer rooms to a journalism career, by now a severely downsized industry (my second newspaper struggled to figure out the Internet and botched it, by focusing not on news content but car and real estate ads)
	6:56pm Marie in Queens: I think making a living as a writer has been hard for a long time. "Everyone's a writer"--ie, a lot of people think they write better than they actually do
	🤖 6:56pm Handy Haversack: Thanks, Mark, Dave! This has been great. Wonderful insights. Sincerely grateful. Later on, all. Stay angry.
	6:56pm dale: ↳ JJ NY-SC @6:56 if they paid - sure!
	🤖 6:56pm Webhamster Henry: Dave said "You need humans", so he'll never get hired again.
	🤖 6:57pm Webhamster Henry: There are lots of major sites that don't even have a support email that goes to a human.
	6:57pm DanFA: Mark, you should watch the Twilight Zone episode Brain Center at Whipples.
	6:57pm prof.fuzz: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:56 same with photography and graphic design... not to mention history (oh, wait, i just did!).
	6:58pm ultradamno: ↳ HollyRT @6:55 Reminds me of the accolades he weirdly got after doing the worst SNL hosting job since Steve Forbes
	🤖 6:58pm Ken From Hyde Park: Bottom line to all this: it's complicated. Thanks, DJs!
	6:58pm Marie in Queens: ↳ prof.fuzz @6:57 yeah, right!
	6:58pm Danny in Poughkeepsie: Thanks Mark and Save. I am really depressed now
	🤖 6:58pm Webhamster Henry: Mark & Dave, you made it to the end of this fast moving show!
	6:58pm coelacanth∅: the computer programmed it to sound just like Madonna. of course it's good!
	6:59pm Marie in Queens: Really great show today--thanks, Mark and Dave!
	6:59pm Rolando: A very pleasant interview- thank you.
	6:59pm StringOFperils: Thanks Mark and Dave.
	6:59pm Pas Musique: Hi Dave!
	🤖 6:59pm Bas NL: Best human DJ chat. Thanks Mark and Dave.
	🤖 6:59pm chresti: Thanks Mark and Dave!
	🤖 7:00pm Ken From Hyde Park: Whoever Smelta, Delta! ✈️
	7:00pm disco_nap_: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:56 I know people might think that but most people can't string a f*cking sentence together...even smart, educated people. It's maddening.
	7:00pm coelacanth∅: Thanks Mark! Thanks Dave!
	🤖 7:00pm Webhamster Henry: Time Trout: vocals improvised by: Viv Corringham, kind of a preview of Vocal Fry as well.
	7:00pm disco_nap_: Anyhoo thanks Mark & Dave
	7:01pm Mark Hurst: Thanks, everyone! Good comments!
	7:05pm Marie in Queens: ↳ disco_nap_ @7:00 I agree

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from May 1, 2023

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May 1, 2023: How working in the tech industry has changed, with WFMU's Dave Mandl

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Dave Mandl, host of It’s Complicated, who has worked as a computer programmer for three decades. Mandl explains how working in tech has changed over the years - and why, if he was starting out today, he might choose a different line of work.

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How working in the tech industry has changed, with WFMU's Dave Mandl
Tomaš Dvořák	Game Boy Tune "Game Boy Tune" by "Tomaš Dvořák"
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Listener comments!
	6:00pm ultradamno: Mark! Mandltons!
	6:01pm G: Should be interesting...
	6:01pm Rolando: Good morning Friends. Finally I’m on time and on the right day, I’m speaking about myself. I’m looking forward to the show.
	🤖 6:02pm PaulRobeson1923: Morninggggggggggggg
	6:02pm G: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:02 Morning where? S Korea?
	6:04pm efd: not sure how you snagged this guest but well done!
	6:05pm Carmichael: I've heard of this guy.
	🤖 6:05pm DjLorraine: Most important hour in current history, hey radio neighbors
	🤖 6:05pm chresti: Hi Mark and Dave and techtonians!
	6:05pm Ciggy: PROG / TECH
	🤖 6:05pm Handy Haversack: Mark! Techyons! Dave!
	🤖 6:06pm Bas NL: Hi mark! Hi Techtonicies!
	6:06pm Peter from Boonton formerly Dover NJ: Good evening Mark, Dave, and techies.
	🤖 6:06pm Ken From Hyde Park: Hello and welcome to punch card talk!
	6:07pm G: ↳ Ken From Hyde Park @6:06 Or, yellow tape with holes in it, early 1970s.
	6:07pm Jackie G: Hope Dave sticks around for It's Complicated.
	🤖 6:07pm Handy Haversack: ↳ efd @6:04 Fortune favors the bold, efd!
	6:07pm T GRavel: Hi David and Mark !
	6:07pm Marie in Queens: I like to think I am a frand of all the DJs @) Hey everybody.
	6:08pm ultradamno: Last night's John Oliver piece on immigration had an interesting sidebar of interest to this show (the disastrous app for scheduling asylum hearings)
	🤖 6:08pm PaulRobeson1923: WHAT ACCOUNTS FOR HISTORICAL CHANGE
	🤖 6:09pm Handy Haversack: I used to be kind of jealous of my friends who went into tech. They just have so much more money than we have. Now I mainly pity them. And wish they'd stop doing this to the rest of us.
	6:09pm dale: i worked in design and then advertising. you get promoted and when they need to cut costs they look from the top down to cut. i can't imagine trying to age out in that game today.
	6:09pm Jackie G: ↳ ultradamno @6:08 John Oliver's show is great. Mark reference's it on occasion
	6:10pm Carmichael: When will Skynet become aware??
	6:10pm Juli: Good evening:::}}}
	6:10pm P-90: Hurst + Mandl. Clash of the Titans.
	🤖 6:10pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Carmichael @6:10 Eh, when it stops raining.
	🤖 6:11pm Webhamster Henry: Hi Davem! Dave was part of the original WFMU-gets-on-the-Internet project.
	6:12pm ultradamno: Well, weather radar won't help against the constant bird attacks anyway.
	6:12pm morphe': ↳ P-90 @6:10 Hurst + Mandl = Tag Team Gentle Giants ... working for the good of HumanKind...
	6:12pm Peter from Boonton formerly Dover NJ: LOLZ, I sat in an airplane for 3 hours b4 takeoff while the pilots re-installed a critical database. Same trip, I was on an in-country trip in China where plane was diverted bigly due to typhoon.
	🤖 6:12pm chresti: Boy I hate flying
	6:13pm Fredericks: Dee Plane, Dee plane!
	6:13pm HollyRT: Oh God, this story. Worst nightmare
	6:13pm Sam: This is why we need high speed rail!!
	🤖 6:13pm Handy Haversack: ↳ morphe' @6:12 Yeah, play Gentle Giant!
	🤖 6:14pm DjLorraine: Anyone see Roy Wood Jr at correspondants dinner?
	6:14pm Jackie G: Half way home the plane ran out of gas. Had to turn around and get more gas,
	6:14pm morphe': Bag count = no bag on the plane unless it is connected to a person on the plane ... an actual good anti-bomb regulation ...
	🤖 6:15pm DjLorraine: Weights and balances. I worked baggage for AA
	6:15pm Jeff Golick: This airplane story is giving me PTSD.
	6:15pm ultradamno: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Only part I did watch, he did reasonably well, it's not any comedians ideal audience.
	6:15pm Marie in Queens: What a nightmare
	🤖 6:16pm PaulRobeson1923: McArthur!
	6:16pm Ciggy: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Yes. He was biting & always introspective
	6:16pm Jackie G: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:15 Is this a bad dream or a real story?
	🤖 6:17pm Handy Haversack: Take MARTA. It's smarta.
	6:17pm dale: i highly recommend bethlehem as an overnight. nice bars and the cooling towers for the steel mills are super cool.
	🤖 6:17pm DjLorraine: ↳ ultradamno @6:15 Exactly. Having to make light of serious situations that they try to get people to address.
	6:18pm Sam: Doesn’t the airline have to put you up?
	6:18pm Rolando: Just sharing my thoughts : For what it’s worth I manage 1600+ devices (1400 students and teachers) for this school on the Sunshine Coast, Australia http://glasshouse.QLD.edu.au. In its getting tricky ethically, after 18 years of service I’m torn between surveillance, monitoring, cloud services, sharing data, protecting students and parents and data. Knowing and understanding where tech is headed if we allow it to travel unrestricted to where the “tech bro’s” are headed is wearing on the mind. Thanks Mark for all you do!
	6:18pm ultradamno: ↳ ultradamno @6:15 And the MET gala is going on now, they should find a way to consolidate the two events twitter.com...
	6:18pm Marie in Queens: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 I heard one excerpt about that gajillionire "buying" Clarence Thomas--powerfull. I'm gonna find his whole monologue. I love listening to those
	6:19pm G: You can do anything you want on the internet, as long as it's what they want to let you do.
	6:19pm Juli: I'm never getting on a plane again haha shite I have nightmares about it haha
	6:19pm Jackie G: Kinda feeling bad for Dave right now.
	🤖 6:19pm chresti: You'd go, I'd go "postal"!
	6:19pm patrick321: My niece had somewhat less of a nightmare going to San Diego from Newark and I saw a couple of similar play by plays on the tweeter about the air travel nightmare yesterday.
	6:20pm StringOFperils: The algorithm says it's time for you to stay calm and go for a long long walk.
	🤖 6:20pm Ken From Hyde Park: The airline - hotel - ground transportation supply chain.
	6:21pm ike-o: There's nothing better than a jerk that gets technology
	🤖 6:22pm Webhamster Henry: I can always pull the line " Oh I used to write customer support consoles" if they seem to not think they can, say , escalate the problem.
	6:23pm Juli: I want to go to Japan::::: Dystopian futures
	6:23pm Marie in Queens: I think some of them are designed to put off customers so the business doesn't have to do anything and then they save $ (bastards)
	🤖 6:23pm Webhamster Henry: I hate the voice recognition IRV bots!
	6:23pm Jackie G: Press 1 for Englsh Press 2 for everything else Press zero for a real (kinda) person
	🤖 6:23pm chresti: ↳ ike-o @6:21 My son's like that- he'll call a car rental place to get me a better deal by reading them the riot act.
	6:24pm HollyRT: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:23 100%
	🤖 6:24pm Webhamster Henry: What I often get is " I'll transfer you to another department" -- CLICK.
	6:24pm ultradamno: Apple's customer support seems to be 'your answer can be found only by going on a search engine easter egg hunt...good luck!"
	6:24pm Marie in Queens: And worst of all is how most companies now hide their phone numbers or are virtually unreachable
	🤖 6:25pm chresti: I hate AI customer service, it always hangs up on me.
	🤖 6:25pm MarciB: This convo is so righteous!
	🤖 6:25pm Ken From Hyde Park: Press the star key to speak with a ChatGTP bot.
	6:26pm dale: my wife works in a bank. half her day is dealing with old people who don't WANT to look up their balances on a computer or phone and just want to come in to visit because they are lonely. and then she gets yelled at for not doing more cold calls to sell whatever product they want pushed at that moment.
	6:27pm dale: ....but they bring candy or donuts for the bank employees. which is bizarre to me.
	6:27pm ultradamno: Xfinity is worse...there's no hope of getting a person any more it's automated 'we're sending a pulse' wait many hours and call back for the same message if it doesn't work.
	6:27pm Chris Hiatt: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:17 What was that high speed train option from Neuromancer? The BAMA? That's what I want to take!
	6:28pm that girl from that place: They do not do that any more at aircanada unfortunately
	🤖 6:28pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Chris Hiatt @6:27 We've slid past Neuromancer on the dystopia scale.
	6:28pm Lee B: Similar story Mark but a very different outcome. 2 weeks ago I was traveling from Tokyo to LGA with my son. We got to LA and were going to miss our connection through Chicago, so I rebooked, but the only flights were the next day. Exhausted we resigned to that, and signed up for a flight to Chi and then back to NY the next morning, but the agent booked my 16 yo son and I on separate flights. I got loud and said I'm going to have to speak to your manager. The agent basically thanked me and said, we only have access to some info, but the managers can make bigger changes! We were quickly booked on a direct flight to JFK and came out almost unscathed.
	🤖 6:29pm Webhamster Henry: Well you know, no human, no need to pay health care. So: Universal Health care will let more people be employed!
	6:29pm Sam: You’ve got to stop giving these companies your business. If they lose enough business the market will correct itself. People have to stop putting up with this.
	6:29pm G: I, Underling to Robots
	6:30pm StringOFperils: I Roadblock
	6:31pm Ciggy: There. Right there. Dave said it, "it's Complicated."
	6:31pm Niall: I'm trying to recover an old Instagram account that's tied to a phone number I no longer have. I've uploaded selfie videos like eight times and they've rejected every attempt with no additional recourse. All I wanna do is see pictures of my old dog....
	🤖 6:31pm Handy Haversack: Dave is getting at the crux -- the "digital transformation" has always been profoundly antilabor, just like all other capitalist "revolutions," which are better described as consolidations -- especially in the more and more wealth concentrated in a smaller field of humans. You cannot preserve the tech economic system in any way like it's been established without continuing its crushinh antilabor, antihuman ways. It has to be overturned entirely and tech put in the service of the people. Not the other way round.
	🤖 6:31pm Webhamster Henry: in re: diagnose the problem with your car: This Bot has been trained on 30 years of "Car Talk".
	6:31pm Jeff Golick: ↳ Ciggy @6:31 Ha!
	6:31pm Ciggy: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:28 New Rose Hotel
	🤖 6:32pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 *crushing
	🤖 6:32pm Webhamster Henry: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 Good to point out on May 1st!
	6:32pm Ike: Ah, the grim state of my field…
	🤖 6:33pm Handy Haversack: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:32 Ha, right! Though needful to point out every day.
	6:33pm coelacanth∅: hey it works for the 1%
	🤖 6:34pm PaulRobeson1923: What happens when few people care about the typos and the computers have a pistol?
	6:34pm StringOFperils: AI says, "Have a nice trip. Nice knowing you." ideas.ted.com...
	6:34pm DanFA: Brazilesque
	6:34pm Jeff Golick: This is the thing with AI/bots - they make errors constantly and the tech folks will simply, shamelessly make the case that this is somehow fine. The bots will make the same case, presumably.
	6:34pm ultradamno: At least Brazil had pneumatic tubes
	🤖 6:34pm Handy Haversack: "Share and enjoy."
	6:34pm Carmichael: The good news is that computers will do exactly what they are told. The bad news is that computers will do excactly what they're told.
	6:34pm Dano59: First they came for the copy editors, and I did not speak out. Than they caym 4 da riters an I coudn unnestan anythin i was reedin
	🤖 6:35pm Handy Haversack: ↳ ultradamno @6:34 And an active rebellion!
	6:35pm G: Kafka worked for years compiling reports and portfolios in the labor disability bureaucracy of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. So much inspiration!
	6:35pm HollyRT: ↳ Sam @6:29 You know there are only like five companies now, right?
	6:35pm Fredericks: Cheap. Fast. Good. You can choose only two. When it comes to A.I., it seems like the companies are choosing same two over and over and it ain't good.
	6:35pm Carmichael: And Central Services.
	🤖 6:35pm chresti: The money bags are far removed from the suffering- they only look at the numbers..
	6:35pm Dano59: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:34 typos happen in code and that may be the crux of the problem
	6:36pm Chris Hiatt: Time Trout!
	🤖 6:36pm PaulRobeson1923: ↳ Dano59 @6:35 How do we take the guns away from the Computers?
	🤖 6:37pm chresti: Oh wow LARB!
	6:37pm DanFA: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 You'll have to pry them from their cold metal claws.
	6:38pm G: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 Sorry, Dave, I'm afraid you can't do that.
	6:38pm StringOFperils: ↳ PaulRobeson1923 @6:36 HALAR15ious!
	6:38pm ?: ↳ DjLorraine @6:14 Would've been better if he brought the rest of Wizzard with him
	🤖 6:38pm Handy Haversack: Buzzfeed tried to go with AI writers just before going out of business. I guess next time it will take. But the answer is partly that these media outlets have long since stopped serving the public good. Those organs that ARE trying to do so won't go down this road. Now, that might not let the signal penetrate the noise, but journalism that is imbricate with capitalism will never serve the public except clandestinely and on its extreme margins.
	6:38pm Marie in Queens: In a way (maybe many) it is in business's best interests to have a part part of the population who is just literate enough to be a docile consumer and docile worker
	6:39pm Marie in Queens: and won't notice/care about errors in writing
	🤖 6:39pm Handy Haversack: Bless writers who are also editors. I have worked on books by some journalists, and wow, their reliance on the copy desk is pretty clear!
	6:39pm ?: ↳ Sam @6:18 I got bumped off an AA flight for a service dog. F'ed up my whole vacation
	6:39pm Dano59: the Arthur C. Clarke story about inventory paperwork in space and an "offog" comes to mind
	6:40pm Ike: Oh, the bots will make copy-editing errors! The errors will be ones they’re aping from the source material that’s been input into the algorithm to “train” it — though admittedly they’ll be minimal.
	🤖 6:40pm DjLorraine: ↳ Jeff Golick @6:34 They mentioned that on npr today
	🤖 6:40pm Webhamster Henry: Editors will be needed to edit the ChatGPT article firehose.
	6:40pm efd: I'd also like to add that Dave takes some great photos, particularly of little-seen parts of Brooklyn, which he occasionally posts on his Mastodon account (@dmandl@mastodon.social)
	6:40pm Joe R.: I’m a recovering techie (nearly 30 years coding, 5 yrs user experience design) on an extended career break and I feel like I’m in the same boat as Dave—I don’t know that I’d take that path today.
	6:41pm Carmichael: ↳ @6:38 Hopefully he did "Angel Fingers".
	6:42pm dale: i moved into painting and drywall. artificial intelligence can't do that yet.
	6:43pm Jeff Golick: Read a book?? Look at Prof. Einstein over here.
	6:43pm Dano59: ↳ Webhamster Henry @6:40 "ChatGPT fixer" becomes the new breed of copy editor. if only.
	🤖 6:43pm Webhamster Henry: Applications basically build themselves these days, even without Machine Learning. My contention for years is that someone will converse with an AI that will use those constantly revised specs to write the actual code - and the documentation and the instructions and make the tutorial videos.
	🤖 6:43pm Handy Haversack: Episode with interview with Carolyn Chen, author of /Work, Pray, Code/: www.wfmu.org...
	6:44pm Dano59: ... anyone see Bill Maher's slavish, fawning interview with Elon on Friday?
	6:45pm Marie in Queens: Are today's techies yesterday's engineers?
	6:45pm DanFA: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 Oh god. I unfortunately have.
	6:45pm Rolando: Newly “minted techies” is a perfect description for the advocates of technology.
	6:45pm efd: I'm not as hardcore as Dave but I did PC-based programming for about a decade in the mid '80s into the '90s. I had been an English major, and the guy who hired me into the IT dep't at my first regular corporate job had also been an English major. Never would have happened 10-15 years later, let alone today I don't think.
	6:46pm DanFA: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 He was practically drooling over Musk. Yes, please, tell us about the woke mind virus, daddy.
	🤖 6:46pm PaulRobeson1923: Eat, sleep, breath “tech” Bucky Fuller talks about over specialization leading to extinction in the Natural world- thank goodness we have better foresight than those stupid seed eating birds
	6:46pm ultradamno: I stopped with Maher altogether at some point during the pandemic (I think the final straw was that stupid Mao statuette)...regret not doing it sooner. He's just awful.
	🤖 6:47pm Webhamster Henry: ↳ efd @6:45 I have a B.A. in Computer Science and English. I think English majors will be hired in tech jobs because the bots will do the grunt work of coding, and the English majors will be lots cheaper than Comp Sci majors.
	6:47pm Dano59: my most maddening bad-vibe bout with tech "customer service" was in trying to finally cancel an Earthlink service that kept billing me after I'd canceled it. they insisted I call them and wait in voicemail hell for at least 90 minutes each time. no email recourse, no online form.
	🤖 6:47pm chresti: That's easy "Roses are red.." etc
	🤖 6:48pm Ken From Hyde Park: ↳ efd @6:45 Even if your code may have been suspect, at least it was well-commented.
	🤖 6:48pm DjLorraine: ↳ Dano59 @6:44 Yes
	🤖 6:48pm Webhamster Henry: Dave speaks for me about Tech Interviews. Some people get it, some people have a bunch of checkpoints.
	6:49pm full_english_breakfast: the live-coding / leetcode tech interview gauntlet... i hate it!
	6:49pm Layet Johnson: Who was it that said the only interview question should be to name a poem they’ve read? That’s wonderful. I’m thinking about some tech friends who are increasingly impossible to communicate with the older we get, the more I invest in art and the more they invest in tech :(
	6:49pm Niall: I haven't had to endure the Tech Interview, but I'm strongly considering a late-life career change. Lord knows what I'd do; I'm pretty much only good at one thing.
	6:50pm Dano59: ↳ DanFA @6:46 they shared lib-bashing common ground. He's still a loon and a fraud, albeit a rich one.
	6:50pm HollyRT: ↳ Handy Haversack @6:31 Gatekeeping on steroids
	6:50pm P-90: “WHAT are you trying to do…?!”
	🤖 6:50pm Webhamster Henry: There is this mythological bunch of 200% effort guys that Elon thinks will work for him.
	🤖 6:50pm Bas NL: No knowledge, can not answer.
	🤖 6:51pm Handy Haversack: To work for the wrong companies doing wrong things for the benefit only of the owners. Rotten process, rotten outcome.
	🤖 6:51pm chresti: ↳ Dano59 @6:47 My son loves dealing with customer service like that to fix a problem like being over charged, etc
	6:51pm mespr: ↳ Layet Johnson @6:49 I was asked to recite a poem to get into college, for a philosophy major/ cs minor.
	🤖 6:51pm PaulRobeson1923: Buy a gun for your computer
	6:52pm Dano59: gollum over there reminds my of my friend in tech who referred to his first iPhone as "the Precious"
	6:52pm mespr: Institutions are teaching the unnecessary frameworks promoted by Google, Twitter and Facebook. It hides how attainable the core languages are. We don't need this. I completely ignore education history when I hire people... I just try working with them for a bit.
	6:52pm ultradamno: I did see where Musk said The Onion was now "jarringly unfunny" because 'woke isn't real'. Some backstory www.theverge.com...
	6:54pm ultradamno: ...or 'woke is a lie' rather, is the exact quote. From the man who cordially invited Trump back to Twitter
	6:54pm coelacanth∅: my one nephew would definitely high-five someone for shooting down a supposedly inferior applicant. arrogant douchebag who idolizes elon musk. not 20 minutes would pass in his company without him telling a story that included him saying he "was the smartest person there". ...obviously a stupid person.
	🤖 6:54pm Bas NL: 10 print "Is that all there is?" 20 goto 10
	🤖 6:54pm chresti: Haha cult fit
	6:54pm dale: i once interviewed at a place called notovitz and perrault, they did the mtv moon flag animation stuff. the woman just wanted to talk to me about what bars and clubs i went to. she said 'i have to like you before i hire you.' i said the pyramid and aztec lounge but never got a second interview.
	6:55pm Niall: chatgpt was a useful and helpful teacher with some stuff I don't know well, like XSLT. It falls apart quickly, but when it does its job well, it's well helpful. Like an interactive manpage.
	6:55pm HollyRT: ↳ ultradamno @6:52 That's rich coming from the unfunniest person in America.
	6:55pm Layet Johnson: Where’d you go @mespr? Very cool
	6:56pm JJ NY-SC: They want to know if you'll go drinking with them after work.
	6:56pm Dano59: I went from six years in computer rooms to a journalism career, by now a severely downsized industry (my second newspaper struggled to figure out the Internet and botched it, by focusing not on news content but car and real estate ads)
	6:56pm Marie in Queens: I think making a living as a writer has been hard for a long time. "Everyone's a writer"--ie, a lot of people think they write better than they actually do
	🤖 6:56pm Handy Haversack: Thanks, Mark, Dave! This has been great. Wonderful insights. Sincerely grateful. Later on, all. Stay angry.
	6:56pm dale: ↳ JJ NY-SC @6:56 if they paid - sure!
	🤖 6:56pm Webhamster Henry: Dave said "You need humans", so he'll never get hired again.
	🤖 6:57pm Webhamster Henry: There are lots of major sites that don't even have a support email that goes to a human.
	6:57pm DanFA: Mark, you should watch the Twilight Zone episode Brain Center at Whipples.
	6:57pm prof.fuzz: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:56 same with photography and graphic design... not to mention history (oh, wait, i just did!).
	6:58pm ultradamno: ↳ HollyRT @6:55 Reminds me of the accolades he weirdly got after doing the worst SNL hosting job since Steve Forbes
	🤖 6:58pm Ken From Hyde Park: Bottom line to all this: it's complicated. Thanks, DJs!
	6:58pm Marie in Queens: ↳ prof.fuzz @6:57 yeah, right!
	6:58pm Danny in Poughkeepsie: Thanks Mark and Save. I am really depressed now
	🤖 6:58pm Webhamster Henry: Mark & Dave, you made it to the end of this fast moving show!
	6:58pm coelacanth∅: the computer programmed it to sound just like Madonna. of course it's good!
	6:59pm Marie in Queens: Really great show today--thanks, Mark and Dave!
	6:59pm Rolando: A very pleasant interview- thank you.
	6:59pm StringOFperils: Thanks Mark and Dave.
	6:59pm Pas Musique: Hi Dave!
	🤖 6:59pm Bas NL: Best human DJ chat. Thanks Mark and Dave.
	🤖 6:59pm chresti: Thanks Mark and Dave!
	🤖 7:00pm Ken From Hyde Park: Whoever Smelta, Delta! ✈️
	7:00pm disco_nap_: ↳ Marie in Queens @6:56 I know people might think that but most people can't string a f*cking sentence together...even smart, educated people. It's maddening.
	7:00pm coelacanth∅: Thanks Mark! Thanks Dave!
	🤖 7:00pm Webhamster Henry: Time Trout: vocals improvised by: Viv Corringham, kind of a preview of Vocal Fry as well.
	7:00pm disco_nap_: Anyhoo thanks Mark & Dave
	7:01pm Mark Hurst: Thanks, everyone! Good comments!
	7:05pm Marie in Queens: ↳ disco_nap_ @7:00 I agree

Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from May 1, 2023

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